Spring Break
Stop the foreign aid for Israel
Abstract:
My comments from last week about Israel generated a lot of attention, so I thought I'd devote a whole column to the subject, starting with taking a closer look at the birth of modern Israel.
I'll begin by quoting Mahatma Gandhi, who in 1947 said, "The Jews are a persecuted people worthy of world sympathy and India sympathizes with them ....
- Displaying 1 - 50 of 62
- Next 12 Comments
Arvensis
posted 12/09/08 @ 4:56 PM MST
Ian -
There are certain facts that you are not going to get from the mainstream media. As I pointed out replying to your last article: there is an overwhelming number of Israeli citizens serving in our government. They are dual citizens with the US and Israel. If things are ever going to change for the United States, we need a complete overhaul of our political system and we need to start upholding the constitution.
They are operating on an agenda for the betterment of their true loyalty.
There are certain facts that you are not going to get from the mainstream media. As I pointed out replying to your last article: there is an overwhelming number of Israeli citizens serving in our government. They are dual citizens with the US and Israel. If things are ever going to change for the United States, we need a complete overhaul of our political system and we need to start upholding the constitution.
They are operating on an agenda for the betterment of their true loyalty.
JS
posted 12/09/08 @ 6:27 PM MST
>>""On November 29, 1947, after much debate and discussion, the UN recommended the partition of Palestine into two states one Jewish and one Arab. The Jews accepted the UN resolution while the Arabs rejected it.""
Well, of course Arabs would reject that. Anybody would.
Just imagine I obtain a court order to partition your own house into two halves; one belonging to you, the rightful owner, while the other half goes to me, who's got the entire support of the court behind him.
Would you accept that? Hey, watch out. If you don't, then you're automatically going to labeled 'hostile' and worse yet, a 'terrorist.'
Oh, btw, since you seem to be fond of quoting UN resolutions, did it ever occur to you to reveal to the misinformed American public that Israel has actually violated dozens of these resolutions (under the help and protection of the US) including the borders of the 1948 Israeli state? And that since the 1967 war, Israel has illegally seized and occupied Palestinian and Syrian lands and till this day refuses to give them back?
>>"Less than 24 hours later, the regular armies of Egypt, Trans-Jordan, Syria, Lebanon and Iraq invaded the country."
OMG that is so horrendous.
Well, first of all, we need to understand that when we discuss Israel, we are not really speaking of a geographically small state. Rather, we're referring to a militarily powerful country with NUCLEAR might (the only country in the Middle East with such a right) and unconditional support from the US, UK, UN, and EU.
Furthermore, if Israel arrogates the power to invade and occupy Egyptian, Syrian and Lebanese lands to fulfill its "divine mission" of the "promised land," then it is only natural that these countries respond in accordance with the nature of the continuous assaults. Or only Israel has a right to "self-defense?"
Hell, the US just waged two full-scale, all-out wars against two sovereign nations wiping out MILLIONS of innocent civilians without either of these two states even thinking of occupying American land.
>>"From 1948 until today, Israel has defended itself successfully in the 1948 War for Independence"
Since when is stealing land called "independence" and murdering the innocent "self-defense?"
>>"and the 1973 Yom Kippur War."
do you really believe Israel won the 1973 war? You know what? I don't blame you. Limiting your media sources to the wrenched American mainstream media can really brainwash you.
Did you even know what's been going on in Gaza for the past month? Did you know that Israel has sealed the strip's crossings and that one and half million innocent people don't have access to food or fuel or medicine under the Israeli "peace process" despite the numerous pleas by the UN and other countries? Did you know that reporters are being prevented from accessing the strip by Israeli forces?(so much for the beacon of democracy and free speech in the Middle East)
Did you know that none of this has been justly covered by US media?
(Of course if somebody from the Palestinian side retaliates.. wowoow. The news is all over the front pages)
>>"It has been a long standing goal of the Arabs to forever erase the Jewish people from this earth."
WHAT'S YOUR SOURCE? Is this what they instill in your mind to justify the heinous aggressions?
>>"For you to presume that a 23% arab unemployment rate in Israel is a human rights violation,"
That's just in Israel. It's MUCH higher in the shattered Palestinian lands.
>>"when Jews in Arab countries are given absolutely no rights at all, is a heinous testament to your ignorance."
Then you're implying that Israel isn't a democracy and is discriminating against its own people, unless of course they don't consider Arabs a people (which they don't.)
Well, of course Arabs would reject that. Anybody would.
Just imagine I obtain a court order to partition your own house into two halves; one belonging to you, the rightful owner, while the other half goes to me, who's got the entire support of the court behind him.
Would you accept that? Hey, watch out. If you don't, then you're automatically going to labeled 'hostile' and worse yet, a 'terrorist.'
Oh, btw, since you seem to be fond of quoting UN resolutions, did it ever occur to you to reveal to the misinformed American public that Israel has actually violated dozens of these resolutions (under the help and protection of the US) including the borders of the 1948 Israeli state? And that since the 1967 war, Israel has illegally seized and occupied Palestinian and Syrian lands and till this day refuses to give them back?
>>"Less than 24 hours later, the regular armies of Egypt, Trans-Jordan, Syria, Lebanon and Iraq invaded the country."
OMG that is so horrendous.
Well, first of all, we need to understand that when we discuss Israel, we are not really speaking of a geographically small state. Rather, we're referring to a militarily powerful country with NUCLEAR might (the only country in the Middle East with such a right) and unconditional support from the US, UK, UN, and EU.
Furthermore, if Israel arrogates the power to invade and occupy Egyptian, Syrian and Lebanese lands to fulfill its "divine mission" of the "promised land," then it is only natural that these countries respond in accordance with the nature of the continuous assaults. Or only Israel has a right to "self-defense?"
Hell, the US just waged two full-scale, all-out wars against two sovereign nations wiping out MILLIONS of innocent civilians without either of these two states even thinking of occupying American land.
>>"From 1948 until today, Israel has defended itself successfully in the 1948 War for Independence"
Since when is stealing land called "independence" and murdering the innocent "self-defense?"
>>"and the 1973 Yom Kippur War."
do you really believe Israel won the 1973 war? You know what? I don't blame you. Limiting your media sources to the wrenched American mainstream media can really brainwash you.
Did you even know what's been going on in Gaza for the past month? Did you know that Israel has sealed the strip's crossings and that one and half million innocent people don't have access to food or fuel or medicine under the Israeli "peace process" despite the numerous pleas by the UN and other countries? Did you know that reporters are being prevented from accessing the strip by Israeli forces?(so much for the beacon of democracy and free speech in the Middle East)
Did you know that none of this has been justly covered by US media?
(Of course if somebody from the Palestinian side retaliates.. wowoow. The news is all over the front pages)
>>"It has been a long standing goal of the Arabs to forever erase the Jewish people from this earth."
WHAT'S YOUR SOURCE? Is this what they instill in your mind to justify the heinous aggressions?
>>"For you to presume that a 23% arab unemployment rate in Israel is a human rights violation,"
That's just in Israel. It's MUCH higher in the shattered Palestinian lands.
>>"when Jews in Arab countries are given absolutely no rights at all, is a heinous testament to your ignorance."
Then you're implying that Israel isn't a democracy and is discriminating against its own people, unless of course they don't consider Arabs a people (which they don't.)
Craig Hawley
posted 12/11/08 @ 2:24 AM MST
You know what I wouldn't do if you took half my house. Teach my five year old child and those od all my neighbors to kill you and anyone of your family or culture or race as the Palestinians have done. I challenge you JS to please show us the hundreds of videos of Jewish Mainstream Schools teaching anything like this...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AY0zE64thJ4
There are hundreds of videos on YouTube like this. Also not long after this video was made Disney sued the Palestinians using this mouse to teach their children to kill all Jews and Americans , so they had an episode where their Mouse was killed by a blood thirsty Jew and replaced him.
I also watched a video of a graduation from Kindergarten in a Mainstream Palestinian school. The little girls were all dressed in some kind of a princess looking outfit. The little boys all wore fatigues and headbands and carried fake AK-47's.
Both girls and boys all screamed how they can't wait until they are old enough to slit the throat of a Jew.
As I said I would love you to post the hundreds of videos of Israeli Kindergartens where they teach this garbage.
And what these animals are doing by teaching this is assuring that we will have generations of terror no matter what is worked out.
If tomorrow the Palestinians and Israelis worked out an agreement and peace was declared , does any thinking person think that a child that was brainwashed by their system and from as early as birth was indoctrinated to hate and kill is going to turn that off and go fly a kite.
So they have created a system that will insure violence whether they wish it or not in the future.
One last observation. The Palestinian people have also had stays in their Arab Brothers countries and every time they get kicked out for causing trouble even in Arab countries.
Until they stop brainwashing future generations into suicide bombers and terrorists , nothing the Palestinians say about wanting peace is believable.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AY0zE64thJ4
There are hundreds of videos on YouTube like this. Also not long after this video was made Disney sued the Palestinians using this mouse to teach their children to kill all Jews and Americans , so they had an episode where their Mouse was killed by a blood thirsty Jew and replaced him.
I also watched a video of a graduation from Kindergarten in a Mainstream Palestinian school. The little girls were all dressed in some kind of a princess looking outfit. The little boys all wore fatigues and headbands and carried fake AK-47's.
Both girls and boys all screamed how they can't wait until they are old enough to slit the throat of a Jew.
As I said I would love you to post the hundreds of videos of Israeli Kindergartens where they teach this garbage.
And what these animals are doing by teaching this is assuring that we will have generations of terror no matter what is worked out.
If tomorrow the Palestinians and Israelis worked out an agreement and peace was declared , does any thinking person think that a child that was brainwashed by their system and from as early as birth was indoctrinated to hate and kill is going to turn that off and go fly a kite.
So they have created a system that will insure violence whether they wish it or not in the future.
One last observation. The Palestinian people have also had stays in their Arab Brothers countries and every time they get kicked out for causing trouble even in Arab countries.
Until they stop brainwashing future generations into suicide bombers and terrorists , nothing the Palestinians say about wanting peace is believable.
Originally posted byJS
>>""On November 29, 1947, after much debate and discussion, the UN recommended the partition of Palestine into two states one Jewish and one Arab. The Jews accepted the UN resolution while the Arabs rejected it.""
Well, of course Arabs would reject that. Anybody would.
Just imagine I obtain a court order to partition your own house into two halves; one belonging to you, the rightful owner, while the other half goes to me, who's got the entire support of the court behind him.
Would you accept that? Hey, watch out. If you don't, then you're automatically going to labeled 'hostile' and worse yet, a 'terrorist.'
Oh, btw, since you seem to be fond of quoting UN resolutions, did it ever occur to you to reveal to the misinformed American public that Israel has actually violated dozens of these resolutions (under the help and protection of the US) including the borders of the 1948 Israeli state? And that since the 1967 war, Israel has illegally seized and occupied Palestinian and Syrian lands and till this day refuses to give them back?
>>"Less than 24 hours later, the regular armies of Egypt, Trans-Jordan, Syria, Lebanon and Iraq invaded the country."
OMG that is so horrendous.
Well, first of all, we need to understand that when we discuss Israel, we are not really speaking of a geographically small state. Rather, we're referring to a militarily powerful country with NUCLEAR might (the only country in the Middle East with such a right) and unconditional support from the US, UK, UN, and EU.
Furthermore, if Israel arrogates the power to invade and occupy Egyptian, Syrian and Lebanese lands to fulfill its "divine mission" of the "promised land," then it is only natural that these countries respond in accordance with the nature of the continuous assaults. Or only Israel has a right to "self-defense?"
Hell, the US just waged two full-scale, all-out wars against two sovereign nations wiping out MILLIONS of innocent civilians without either of these two states even thinking of occupying American land.
>>"From 1948 until today, Israel has defended itself successfully in the 1948 War for Independence"
Since when is stealing land called "independence" and murdering the innocent "self-defense?"
>>"and the 1973 Yom Kippur War."
do you really believe Israel won the 1973 war? You know what? I don't blame you. Limiting your media sources to the wrenched American mainstream media can really brainwash you.
Did you even know what's been going on in Gaza for the past month? Did you know that Israel has sealed the strip's crossings and that one and half million innocent people don't have access to food or fuel or medicine under the Israeli "peace process" despite the numerous pleas by the UN and other countries? Did you know that reporters are being prevented from accessing the strip by Israeli forces?(so much for the beacon of democracy and free speech in the Middle East)
Did you know that none of this has been justly covered by US media?
(Of course if somebody from the Palestinian side retaliates.. wowoow. The news is all over the front pages)
>>"It has been a long standing goal of the Arabs to forever erase the Jewish people from this earth."
WHAT'S YOUR SOURCE? Is this what they instill in your mind to justify the heinous aggressions?
>>"For you to presume that a 23% arab unemployment rate in Israel is a human rights violation,"
That's just in Israel. It's MUCH higher in the shattered Palestinian lands.
>>"when Jews in Arab countries are given absolutely no rights at all, is a heinous testament to your ignorance."
Then you're implying that Israel isn't a democracy and is discriminating against its own people, unless of course they don't consider Arabs a people (which they don't.)
JS
posted 12/11/08 @ 3:36 PM MST
Son,
This is indeed a testament to your own ignorance. You have no idea what Israeli kindergartens and schools indoctrinate their children with. How would you, if all you watch, read and listen to is American mainstream media where Israel remains a taboo?
I watched a report some time ago on a non American TV network about Israeli schools and it was staggering. It was as if each of the books these little kids stow in their backpacks was an atomic bomb awaiting its detonation.
I apologize for not living up to your challenge of sharing youtube videos that testify to my side of the story. One thing that either Palestinians and Arabs have miserably failed at or has been just eclipsed by a giant Western media, is to deliver their agony to good people out there.
>>The Palestinian people have also had stays in their Arab Brothers countries and every time they get kicked out for causing trouble even in Arab countries.
You speak as if you spent a big chunk of your life in an Arab country.
I'd love more elaboration here.
>>Until they stop brainwashing future generations into suicide bombers and terrorists , nothing the Palestinians say about wanting peace is believable.
And until the Jews stop brainwashing future generations that the "promised land" (stretching over more than 9 countries) is an Israeli property http://www.uruknet.it/uruknet-images/greater-israel-map5.jpg , and Evangelicals stop preaching that Jesus won't descend back until the land belongs to the Jews, nothing the Israelis or the West say about wanting peace is believable.
This is indeed a testament to your own ignorance. You have no idea what Israeli kindergartens and schools indoctrinate their children with. How would you, if all you watch, read and listen to is American mainstream media where Israel remains a taboo?
I watched a report some time ago on a non American TV network about Israeli schools and it was staggering. It was as if each of the books these little kids stow in their backpacks was an atomic bomb awaiting its detonation.
I apologize for not living up to your challenge of sharing youtube videos that testify to my side of the story. One thing that either Palestinians and Arabs have miserably failed at or has been just eclipsed by a giant Western media, is to deliver their agony to good people out there.
>>The Palestinian people have also had stays in their Arab Brothers countries and every time they get kicked out for causing trouble even in Arab countries.
You speak as if you spent a big chunk of your life in an Arab country.
I'd love more elaboration here.
>>Until they stop brainwashing future generations into suicide bombers and terrorists , nothing the Palestinians say about wanting peace is believable.
And until the Jews stop brainwashing future generations that the "promised land" (stretching over more than 9 countries) is an Israeli property http://www.uruknet.it/uruknet-images/greater-israel-map5.jpg , and Evangelicals stop preaching that Jesus won't descend back until the land belongs to the Jews, nothing the Israelis or the West say about wanting peace is believable.
Craig Hawley
posted 12/12/08 @ 2:11 AM MST
Yes I do have a little fist hand knowledge of many countries , as I have been fortunate enough to travel abroad.
I was born in the Himalaya mountains of India and lived in Karachi Pakistan. I have lived with Muslims , Sikhs , Hindus , and others.
Thanks for asking.
LOL
I was born in the Himalaya mountains of India and lived in Karachi Pakistan. I have lived with Muslims , Sikhs , Hindus , and others.
Thanks for asking.
LOL
Originally posted byJS
>>""On November 29, 1947, after much debate and discussion, the UN recommended the partition of Palestine into two states one Jewish and one Arab. The Jews accepted the UN resolution while the Arabs rejected it.""
Well, of course Arabs would reject that. Anybody would.
Just imagine I obtain a court order to partition your own house into two halves; one belonging to you, the rightful owner, while the other half goes to me, who's got the entire support of the court behind him.
Would you accept that? Hey, watch out. If you don't, then you're automatically going to labeled 'hostile' and worse yet, a 'terrorist.'
Oh, btw, since you seem to be fond of quoting UN resolutions, did it ever occur to you to reveal to the misinformed American public that Israel has actually violated dozens of these resolutions (under the help and protection of the US) including the borders of the 1948 Israeli state? And that since the 1967 war, Israel has illegally seized and occupied Palestinian and Syrian lands and till this day refuses to give them back?
>>"Less than 24 hours later, the regular armies of Egypt, Trans-Jordan, Syria, Lebanon and Iraq invaded the country."
OMG that is so horrendous.
Well, first of all, we need to understand that when we discuss Israel, we are not really speaking of a geographically small state. Rather, we're referring to a militarily powerful country with NUCLEAR might (the only country in the Middle East with such a right) and unconditional support from the US, UK, UN, and EU.
Furthermore, if Israel arrogates the power to invade and occupy Egyptian, Syrian and Lebanese lands to fulfill its "divine mission" of the "promised land," then it is only natural that these countries respond in accordance with the nature of the continuous assaults. Or only Israel has a right to "self-defense?"
Hell, the US just waged two full-scale, all-out wars against two sovereign nations wiping out MILLIONS of innocent civilians without either of these two states even thinking of occupying American land.
>>"From 1948 until today, Israel has defended itself successfully in the 1948 War for Independence"
Since when is stealing land called "independence" and murdering the innocent "self-defense?"
>>"and the 1973 Yom Kippur War."
do you really believe Israel won the 1973 war? You know what? I don't blame you. Limiting your media sources to the wrenched American mainstream media can really brainwash you.
Did you even know what's been going on in Gaza for the past month? Did you know that Israel has sealed the strip's crossings and that one and half million innocent people don't have access to food or fuel or medicine under the Israeli "peace process" despite the numerous pleas by the UN and other countries? Did you know that reporters are being prevented from accessing the strip by Israeli forces?(so much for the beacon of democracy and free speech in the Middle East)
Did you know that none of this has been justly covered by US media?
(Of course if somebody from the Palestinian side retaliates.. wowoow. The news is all over the front pages)
>>"It has been a long standing goal of the Arabs to forever erase the Jewish people from this earth."
WHAT'S YOUR SOURCE? Is this what they instill in your mind to justify the heinous aggressions?
>>"For you to presume that a 23% arab unemployment rate in Israel is a human rights violation,"
That's just in Israel. It's MUCH higher in the shattered Palestinian lands.
>>"when Jews in Arab countries are given absolutely no rights at all, is a heinous testament to your ignorance."
Then you're implying that Israel isn't a democracy and is discriminating against its own people, unless of course they don't consider Arabs a people (which they don't.)
JS
posted 12/12/08 @ 8:23 PM MST
>>Yes I do have a little fist hand knowledge of many countries , as I have been fortunate enough to travel abroad.
I was born in the Himalaya mountains of India and lived in Karachi Pakistan. I have lived with Muslims , Sikhs , Hindus , and others.
Thanks for asking.
LOL <<
LOL You're welcome. LOL. I don't LOL see how your little LOL first hand knowledge relates to the issue at hand LOL.
I was born in the Himalaya mountains of India and lived in Karachi Pakistan. I have lived with Muslims , Sikhs , Hindus , and others.
Thanks for asking.
LOL <<
LOL You're welcome. LOL. I don't LOL see how your little LOL first hand knowledge relates to the issue at hand LOL.
Sasha
posted 1/22/09 @ 6:07 PM MST
"Well, of course Arabs would reject that. Anybody would".
Faulse. Only idiots would. And in fact, idiots did.
Faulse. Only idiots would. And in fact, idiots did.
JS
posted 12/10/08 @ 3:00 AM MST
>>"there is an overwhelming number of Israeli citizens serving in our government."
You mean somebody like Emanuel who was appointed Wight House Chief of Staff (the 2nd most powerful man in Washington) only day following Election Day?
You mean somebody like Emanuel who was appointed Wight House Chief of Staff (the 2nd most powerful man in Washington) only day following Election Day?
Arvensis
posted 12/10/08 @ 3:07 PM MST
Originally posted byJS
>>"there is an overwhelming number of Israeli citizens serving in our government."
You mean somebody like Emanuel who was appointed Wight House Chief of Staff (the 2nd most powerful man in Washington) only day following Election Day?
Yes. Many others like Emanuel. And it's not as if these people are really trying to hid the facts. I think Americans are too distracted and stupid to pay attention or understand what is going on.
The United States of America that our founder fathers designed, exists no more. It is a complicated mess with little hope. The only solution is to bring people to awareness, and that isn't going to happen when all they read are mis-informed articles such as this.
NL
posted 12/10/08 @ 9:35 AM MST
Hi Ian,
My daughter is a student at CSU and brought to my attention your artical.
I grew up in Israel and yes the stories are sad but Ian, Did you have a chance to visit Israel befor you wrote this artical,do you know how much money Israel give the palestinians?do you know that only today they got 100,000,000 NIS (about $25,000,000)?
Do you know why they are not allowed to cross the "border" to Israel? It all happened after the terrosits attacks on Israelies that went to work or school in the morning and never came back because the bus they were on was blowen to pieces by a crazy man or woman. I can tell you many stories about my life in Israel.My family was there from the begining of times...way before 1947.You have to research both sides before writing about any subject.Try and read more search more and maybe you can find the cause to the Israeli"behavior".
And one more thing,The U.S give money to Israel because Israel is the only safe gateway to the area and a true friend.
My daughter is a student at CSU and brought to my attention your artical.
I grew up in Israel and yes the stories are sad but Ian, Did you have a chance to visit Israel befor you wrote this artical,do you know how much money Israel give the palestinians?do you know that only today they got 100,000,000 NIS (about $25,000,000)?
Do you know why they are not allowed to cross the "border" to Israel? It all happened after the terrosits attacks on Israelies that went to work or school in the morning and never came back because the bus they were on was blowen to pieces by a crazy man or woman. I can tell you many stories about my life in Israel.My family was there from the begining of times...way before 1947.You have to research both sides before writing about any subject.Try and read more search more and maybe you can find the cause to the Israeli"behavior".
And one more thing,The U.S give money to Israel because Israel is the only safe gateway to the area and a true friend.
Aharon A
posted 12/17/08 @ 11:34 AM MST
Nice Article Ian....
NL,
I do not think that you lived in Israel.... Live there first and tell me.....
Please educate yourself before you comment...
Folks, Israel do not give any money to Palestinians - Israel kill them - Palestinians get their money from the EU, Japan, Arab nations and little from the US. Its is so easy now to find information, just look up 'Israeli massacres' and you will find thousands of articles about that...
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&safe=active&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&hs=MqH&sa=X&oi=spell&resnum=0&ct=result&cd=1&q=israeli+massacres&spell=1
Arabs are not just Muslims... Arabs are Jews, Christians, and Muslims.... Israeli also discriminates against eastern Jews (Africans and Arabs Jews)... Also, look online for 'how Israelis treat Arab Christians!!..
http://www.countercurrents.org/pa-nettnin010207.htm
Please educate yourself.........
There is a big distinction between a Jew and a Zionist!!! I was born in Israel but migrated to the US because Israel is one of the worst countries in the world.... Israel hates the US more that any other nation, and there are so happy to see the US economy down!!
Find how "$400B Sent To Israel Ahead Of Lehman BK"
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy/browse_thread/thread/815e262d8e3750db/ac29ee75f8e5a600?lnk=raot
I welling to meet with any of you to talk more about that.....
NL,
I do not think that you lived in Israel.... Live there first and tell me.....
Please educate yourself before you comment...
Folks, Israel do not give any money to Palestinians - Israel kill them - Palestinians get their money from the EU, Japan, Arab nations and little from the US. Its is so easy now to find information, just look up 'Israeli massacres' and you will find thousands of articles about that...
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&safe=active&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&hs=MqH&sa=X&oi=spell&resnum=0&ct=result&cd=1&q=israeli+massacres&spell=1
Arabs are not just Muslims... Arabs are Jews, Christians, and Muslims.... Israeli also discriminates against eastern Jews (Africans and Arabs Jews)... Also, look online for 'how Israelis treat Arab Christians!!..
http://www.countercurrents.org/pa-nettnin010207.htm
Please educate yourself.........
There is a big distinction between a Jew and a Zionist!!! I was born in Israel but migrated to the US because Israel is one of the worst countries in the world.... Israel hates the US more that any other nation, and there are so happy to see the US economy down!!
Find how "$400B Sent To Israel Ahead Of Lehman BK"
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.conspiracy/browse_thread/thread/815e262d8e3750db/ac29ee75f8e5a600?lnk=raot
I welling to meet with any of you to talk more about that.....
Originally posted byNL
Hi Ian,
My daughter is a student at CSU and brought to my attention your artical.
I grew up in Israel and yes the stories are sad but Ian, Did you have a chance to visit Israel befor you wrote this artical,do you know how much money Israel give the palestinians?do you know that only today they got 100,000,000 NIS (about $25,000,000)?
Do you know why they are not allowed to cross the "border" to Israel? It all happened after the terrosits attacks on Israelies that went to work or school in the morning and never came back because the bus they were on was blowen to pieces by a crazy man or woman. I can tell you many stories about my life in Israel.My family was there from the begining of times...way before 1947.You have to research both sides before writing about any subject.Try and read more search more and maybe you can find the cause to the Israeli"behavior".
And one more thing,The U.S give money to Israel because Israel is the only safe gateway to the area and a true friend.
JS
posted 12/17/08 @ 11:53 PM MST
>>Folks, Israel do not give any money to Palestinians<<
Yeah did you read his comment about Israel giving money to the Palestinians? I had a hard laugh when I read it. It was so much outright ignorance (or an outright lie) that I felt obliged to neglect it.
As a matter of fact, Israel, not only keeps, but hijacks all the cash flow coming from the EU and other humanitarian organizations (not sure if Arab nations are high on the list of donors-too terrified of defying the US)
>>Israel hates the US more that any other nation, and there are so happy to see the US economy down!! <<
True. Israel is cleverly exploiting the US by steering its foreign (and domestic) policy towards its own interests.
As it was pointed out by one of the posters above, that's why you see the number of politicians with Jewish/Israeli roots on the rise in any US administration.
Just like it did the UK when it was the world's superpower.
That's also why you'll find the number of Israeli spies operating in the US that are busted by the CIA is huge.
Yeah did you read his comment about Israel giving money to the Palestinians? I had a hard laugh when I read it. It was so much outright ignorance (or an outright lie) that I felt obliged to neglect it.
As a matter of fact, Israel, not only keeps, but hijacks all the cash flow coming from the EU and other humanitarian organizations (not sure if Arab nations are high on the list of donors-too terrified of defying the US)
>>Israel hates the US more that any other nation, and there are so happy to see the US economy down!! <<
True. Israel is cleverly exploiting the US by steering its foreign (and domestic) policy towards its own interests.
As it was pointed out by one of the posters above, that's why you see the number of politicians with Jewish/Israeli roots on the rise in any US administration.
Just like it did the UK when it was the world's superpower.
That's also why you'll find the number of Israeli spies operating in the US that are busted by the CIA is huge.
JS
posted 12/31/08 @ 4:58 PM MST
>>That's also why you'll find the number of Israeli spies operating in the US that are busted by the CIA is huge. <<
US man admits 'spying for Israel':
http://english.aljazeera.net/news/americas/2008/12/2008123019592156851.html
US man admits 'spying for Israel':
http://english.aljazeera.net/news/americas/2008/12/2008123019592156851.html
JS
posted 12/15/08 @ 12:06 PM MST
http://english.aljazeera.net/news/middleeast/2008/12/20081210551198584.html
Registered Independent
posted 12/16/08 @ 6:01 PM MST
Response to "JS":
Oh, well that last posting of yours certainly clears things up regarding the "facts" and viewpoints you have delineated here.
You actually believe "Al Jazeera" to be at least a somewhat legitimate news source.
Whereas in reality, Al Jazeera has about the same level of neutral accuracy as does "Pravda".
Oh, well that last posting of yours certainly clears things up regarding the "facts" and viewpoints you have delineated here.
You actually believe "Al Jazeera" to be at least a somewhat legitimate news source.
Whereas in reality, Al Jazeera has about the same level of neutral accuracy as does "Pravda".
JS
posted 12/17/08 @ 12:35 PM MST
>>You actually believe "Al Jazeera" to be at least a somewhat legitimate news source. <<
No, sorry, neoconservative Donald Rumsfeld called it "inaccurate." My bad.
Fox news and CNN are.
No, sorry, neoconservative Donald Rumsfeld called it "inaccurate." My bad.
Fox news and CNN are.
np
posted 1/06/09 @ 1:48 PM MST
Stop foreign aid everywhere, we need to keep money in the US to fix the problems we have here.
Fahad
posted 1/07/09 @ 12:46 PM MST
Hi,
I am an Arab student in CSU who lived in the middle east for 18 years and will soon start writing an article about the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. until I am done, please visit this interesting website: ifAmericansKnew.com
I am an Arab student in CSU who lived in the middle east for 18 years and will soon start writing an article about the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. until I am done, please visit this interesting website: ifAmericansKnew.com
Binyamin
posted 1/12/09 @ 3:43 PM MST
It is funny to see how US guys are telling Israeli Jews that they don't have any right to live at their land. Hello, how about the Native Americans? What are you guys doing in North America? Applying your own logic to yourself you should pack your bags and go to to your ancestor's land, which I suppose would be Europe.
Binyamin
posted 1/12/09 @ 3:58 PM MST
By the way, applying your argument about the number of victims, Ian, what's your opinion about the WWII? Please compare the number of the civilians killed by the Germany and Japan in the US, and the number of the German and especially Japanese civilians killed by the US. Please tell us who was right and who was wrong in that war. You know, learning history is really helpful.
Fahad
posted 1/14/09 @ 8:53 AM MST
Binyamin,
You aren't making sense, you can't justify what Israel is doing because well it happened before. However, when about 50% of all the casualties in the war on Gaza are women and children then someone should do something about this, btw the land of palestine doesn't belong to the Jews and you can't prove it. in 1947 and before Israel was recognized as a country in the UN, Jews made only 33% of the total population in Palestine, and only 13 of these 33% were legal citizens of Palestine. Palestine was part of the Ottoman empire and later one when the Ottoman empire collapsed it was rules by Muslims before it became a British mandate and later one given to the Jews. So please don't tell me that it belongs to the Jews.
You aren't making sense, you can't justify what Israel is doing because well it happened before. However, when about 50% of all the casualties in the war on Gaza are women and children then someone should do something about this, btw the land of palestine doesn't belong to the Jews and you can't prove it. in 1947 and before Israel was recognized as a country in the UN, Jews made only 33% of the total population in Palestine, and only 13 of these 33% were legal citizens of Palestine. Palestine was part of the Ottoman empire and later one when the Ottoman empire collapsed it was rules by Muslims before it became a British mandate and later one given to the Jews. So please don't tell me that it belongs to the Jews.
Binyamin
posted 1/15/09 @ 6:24 PM MST
Fahad, every innocent life lost in this conflict is a terrible tragedy. Although I am sure your numbers about 50% of the civilians killed by Israel are not correct (BTW can your provide a reliable data source?), still many innocent people were killed both in Gaza and in Israel. This is what happens at any war, so the one who started the war should be blamed. Israel did not start this war, Hamas did. In fact, Israel tolerated terrorist attacks for long time without any response. Israel removed all its citizens from Gaza in 2005. And don't forget that Gasa still receives a majority of its electrical power, fuel, and fresh water from Israel. All Israel received from Gaza is rockets, mortar shells, snipers shooting at farmers working on their fields close to Gaza, and so on. Israel just wants to let Gaza people live on their own. It is even willing to help them by providing with the necessary supplies. But Hamas wants to continue the war. I understand that you are worried about the people killed in Gaza, but are you also worried about Israeli casualties? I know that many people in Palestinian Authority celebrate when innocent people are killed by a Palestinian terrorist in Israel. Some Palestinians even celebrated the 9/11 terror attacks! Is this human? I hope it's the minority of Palestinians who thinks that way. Israeli people never celebrate the death of other people. In conclusion, I am sure that most of the Israelis and most of the Palestinians want peace.
Registered Independent
posted 1/15/09 @ 1:14 PM MST
Response to Fahad:
50% of all of the casualties in Gaza are women and children because Hamas are cowards who don't wear uniforms and hide among the women and children. They also deliberately set up their rocket launchers and ammunition caches either in or right next to, Mosques, schools and hospitals.
This war could end in a few days if Hamas would simply stop firing their rockets into Israeli civilian areas, and you know it. But Hamas refuses to stop launching rockets, and yet they pretend that they care about the poor Palestinian civilians who become casualties when Israel fires back upon Hamas rocket positions. What disgusting tactics, Hamas using their own civilians as human shields.
Your twisted logic (that the Gaza casualties are Israel's fault) may fly among the uneducated, mind-controlled people of the middle east; but that's as far as it goes.
Not to mention that it is extremely difficult to feel sympathy for a people so base that they strap explosives to their own teenagers and send them over to homicide bomb Israeli civilians. In return for payment of $25,000 a piece for the lives of their own kids, of course. Revolting, sub-human behavior.
Your don't notice Bin Laden or any of the Hamas leadership volunteering to strap explosives to themselves, do you? Nope, they are right now hiding underground in a network of tunnels and caves, like the rats that they are. Leaving the civilians on the surface to face the blowback from the Israelis.
If the Palestinians had a brain in their heads they would yank the Hamas leadership out of the dank tunnels where they hide, and string them up in the public square themselves.
And if you had a brain in your head you would stop defending Hamas actions, and demand that they stop firing rockets at Israel. If they actually wanted peace, Hamas wouldn't have started this war with their rocket launchers, and they would not have fired 15 rockets into Israel yesterday, alone.
You and your ilk can just give up on this idea of destroying the Jews. The world has seen all of this before; and neither the United States nor the international community are buying the Jew-haters story that Israel is causing the problem.
50% of all of the casualties in Gaza are women and children because Hamas are cowards who don't wear uniforms and hide among the women and children. They also deliberately set up their rocket launchers and ammunition caches either in or right next to, Mosques, schools and hospitals.
This war could end in a few days if Hamas would simply stop firing their rockets into Israeli civilian areas, and you know it. But Hamas refuses to stop launching rockets, and yet they pretend that they care about the poor Palestinian civilians who become casualties when Israel fires back upon Hamas rocket positions. What disgusting tactics, Hamas using their own civilians as human shields.
Your twisted logic (that the Gaza casualties are Israel's fault) may fly among the uneducated, mind-controlled people of the middle east; but that's as far as it goes.
Not to mention that it is extremely difficult to feel sympathy for a people so base that they strap explosives to their own teenagers and send them over to homicide bomb Israeli civilians. In return for payment of $25,000 a piece for the lives of their own kids, of course. Revolting, sub-human behavior.
Your don't notice Bin Laden or any of the Hamas leadership volunteering to strap explosives to themselves, do you? Nope, they are right now hiding underground in a network of tunnels and caves, like the rats that they are. Leaving the civilians on the surface to face the blowback from the Israelis.
If the Palestinians had a brain in their heads they would yank the Hamas leadership out of the dank tunnels where they hide, and string them up in the public square themselves.
And if you had a brain in your head you would stop defending Hamas actions, and demand that they stop firing rockets at Israel. If they actually wanted peace, Hamas wouldn't have started this war with their rocket launchers, and they would not have fired 15 rockets into Israel yesterday, alone.
You and your ilk can just give up on this idea of destroying the Jews. The world has seen all of this before; and neither the United States nor the international community are buying the Jew-haters story that Israel is causing the problem.
fahad
posted 1/19/09 @ 12:08 AM MST
OK lets suppose Hamas are cowards, does that justify firing killing civilians? Gaza strip is a very small land, about 360 square km, however, there are about 1.5 million people live there. Therefore Israel knows that every rocket will result in a large number of civilian casualties. However, Israel just keeps firing these rockets and it targets civilians, and I can prove it. It fires rockets at 4 schools that are for the UNRWA, which is a humanitarian organization that belongs to the UN. The UNRWA gave Israel the location of these schools and assured that there are no members of any PLOs there. However, Israel just didn't listen and targeted these 4 schools.
Hamas didn't break the cease fire, here is the proof from CNN:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KntmpoRXFX4
The Muslims worldwide will never forget that Palestine belongs to them and Israel shouldn't have existed from the first place. After 60 years of negotiating, I can assure you that the only option that it left to liberate Palestine is force, just as the US have used against Afghanistan and Iraq.
Hamas targets either military personal or open land, unlike Israel that targets civilians. Look at the number of casualties from both sides.
Even the Jews themselves oppose their countries massacres, in London a Rabbi burned his Israeli passport to show his hate to his country. The whole world now knows what Israel is doing and who is the real terrorist and no one can hide it anymore.
Hamas didn't break the cease fire, here is the proof from CNN:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KntmpoRXFX4
The Muslims worldwide will never forget that Palestine belongs to them and Israel shouldn't have existed from the first place. After 60 years of negotiating, I can assure you that the only option that it left to liberate Palestine is force, just as the US have used against Afghanistan and Iraq.
Hamas targets either military personal or open land, unlike Israel that targets civilians. Look at the number of casualties from both sides.
Even the Jews themselves oppose their countries massacres, in London a Rabbi burned his Israeli passport to show his hate to his country. The whole world now knows what Israel is doing and who is the real terrorist and no one can hide it anymore.
Originally posted byRegistered Independent
Response to Fahad:
50% of all of the casualties in Gaza are women and children because Hamas are cowards who don't wear uniforms and hide among the women and children. They also deliberately set up their rocket launchers and ammunition caches either in or right next to, Mosques, schools and hospitals.
This war could end in a few days if Hamas would simply stop firing their rockets into Israeli civilian areas, and you know it. But Hamas refuses to stop launching rockets, and yet they pretend that they care about the poor Palestinian civilians who become casualties when Israel fires back upon Hamas rocket positions. What disgusting tactics, Hamas using their own civilians as human shields.
Your twisted logic (that the Gaza casualties are Israel's fault) may fly among the uneducated, mind-controlled people of the middle east; but that's as far as it goes.
Not to mention that it is extremely difficult to feel sympathy for a people so base that they strap explosives to their own teenagers and send them over to homicide bomb Israeli civilians. In return for payment of $25,000 a piece for the lives of their own kids, of course. Revolting, sub-human behavior.
Your don't notice Bin Laden or any of the Hamas leadership volunteering to strap explosives to themselves, do you? Nope, they are right now hiding underground in a network of tunnels and caves, like the rats that they are. Leaving the civilians on the surface to face the blowback from the Israelis.
If the Palestinians had a brain in their heads they would yank the Hamas leadership out of the dank tunnels where they hide, and string them up in the public square themselves.
And if you had a brain in your head you would stop defending Hamas actions, and demand that they stop firing rockets at Israel. If they actually wanted peace, Hamas wouldn't have started this war with their rocket launchers, and they would not have fired 15 rockets into Israel yesterday, alone.
You and your ilk can just give up on this idea of destroying the Jews. The world has seen all of this before; and neither the United States nor the international community are buying the Jew-haters story that Israel is causing the problem.
Binyamin
posted 1/15/09 @ 6:01 PM MST
Fahad, if you look into history, you would find that virtually no people leave at the same place where they lived hundreds and thousands of years ago. Empires were created and destroyed, old nations disappeared and new nations were created. Jews did not always live in the Land of Israel, and neither did Arabs, they both came there at certain point in history. If everyone tries to return the land that belonged to him some time ago, it will lead to world war. So am not getting your point about Palestine belonging to someone and not belonging to someone else. It belongs to the people who leave there now - both Jews and Arabs. Israel is a state for both Jews and Arabs, and BTW Arabs leaving in Israel have higher living standards than in most Arab countries. It includes among other things education, social system and medicine. There is an Arab state in Palestine - Jordan. And there will be also a Palestinian state. Israel has no objections to its creation. But some (not all!) Palestinians keep saying - no, we want to take all the land and ethnically cleanse all the Jews. This will lead to nothing but a bloodshed.
Registered Independent
posted 1/19/09 @ 4:15 PM MST
Response to fahad:
What a batch of malarkey, fahad.
The whole world knows that it isn't the Israelis who target civilians, it is Hamas. But since Hamas hides both their cowardly backsides and their weaponry among the Palestinian civilians, that's where Israel has to return fire in order to be effective.
And if Israel had to return fire upon Palestinian schools, you can bet your buttons that it was because that's where Hamas had located their rocket launchers and weaponry. Hamas and the other Jew-hating nut jobs don't realize that the entire world is now "on to" their trick of hiding among civilians, and in supposedly off-limits locations like schools, mosques and hospitals. Hamas wants as many civilian casualties as possible because they think that makes their side appealing. Not any more. Hamas et. al. are like the boy who cried wolf, attempting to use that callous trick one too many times.
Virtually no one has been opposing Israel's latest response to the over 1000 rockets Hamas has fired into Israel's civilian areas over the last year. (Except the usual contingent of violent Islamofacist kool-aid drinkers, of course.)
You can only poke a tiger with a stick for just so long, before it loses its temper and decides to take your head off.
Now as of just today there is actually a cease-fire. And why? Because Hamas finally agreed to stop firing rockets at Israel, that's why. (We'll see how long this lasts.) Obviously Hamas could have saved the lives of 1000 Palestinian civilians if they would have agreed to stop firing their rockets three weeks ago. And Gaza's infrastructure is in ruins, as well.
Israel is now pulling entirely out of Gaza. For exactly as long as Hamas can manage to keep their itchy trigger-fingers off of their rocket launchers, that is.
Here's the truth of the matter: If the arabs would permanently lay down their arms, there would be lasting peace throughout the middle east. But if Israel lays down their weapons, there would be no more Israel.
So that is never, ever going to happen.
And as for your claim that Israel really "belongs to" the arabs, well that isn't surprising. It fits right in with the rest of your irrational, fact-free argument.
What a batch of malarkey, fahad.
The whole world knows that it isn't the Israelis who target civilians, it is Hamas. But since Hamas hides both their cowardly backsides and their weaponry among the Palestinian civilians, that's where Israel has to return fire in order to be effective.
And if Israel had to return fire upon Palestinian schools, you can bet your buttons that it was because that's where Hamas had located their rocket launchers and weaponry. Hamas and the other Jew-hating nut jobs don't realize that the entire world is now "on to" their trick of hiding among civilians, and in supposedly off-limits locations like schools, mosques and hospitals. Hamas wants as many civilian casualties as possible because they think that makes their side appealing. Not any more. Hamas et. al. are like the boy who cried wolf, attempting to use that callous trick one too many times.
Virtually no one has been opposing Israel's latest response to the over 1000 rockets Hamas has fired into Israel's civilian areas over the last year. (Except the usual contingent of violent Islamofacist kool-aid drinkers, of course.)
You can only poke a tiger with a stick for just so long, before it loses its temper and decides to take your head off.
Now as of just today there is actually a cease-fire. And why? Because Hamas finally agreed to stop firing rockets at Israel, that's why. (We'll see how long this lasts.) Obviously Hamas could have saved the lives of 1000 Palestinian civilians if they would have agreed to stop firing their rockets three weeks ago. And Gaza's infrastructure is in ruins, as well.
Israel is now pulling entirely out of Gaza. For exactly as long as Hamas can manage to keep their itchy trigger-fingers off of their rocket launchers, that is.
Here's the truth of the matter: If the arabs would permanently lay down their arms, there would be lasting peace throughout the middle east. But if Israel lays down their weapons, there would be no more Israel.
So that is never, ever going to happen.
And as for your claim that Israel really "belongs to" the arabs, well that isn't surprising. It fits right in with the rest of your irrational, fact-free argument.
Israeli Representatives?
posted 1/20/09 @ 9:21 AM MST
A member of the Israeli war party once commented that New York has only two Senators representing it in Congress. Israel has fifty. Their representation in Congress follows the same trends.
With regards to the Collegian, the Israeli representives are among others Craig Hawley & Registered Independent giving us their misguided and unwavering allegience, much like they have done in the past for Bush, Cheney, McCain, and Palin. How ironic that today is the Bush Cabal's last day.
http://www.brasschecktv.com/page/530.html
It's really not a state secret. Unless you depend on the US news media for your information. Israel create Hamas. Now they're using its existence to slaughter Palestinian civilians.
Ron Paul shares the details:
http://www.brasschecktv.com/page/528.html
Israeli military is dropping white phosphorus on Gaza neighborhoods. Who are you going to believe? The Israeli war party PR department or your own eyes?
http://www.brasschecktv.com/page/532.html
Posted January 15, 2009
The headquarters of the United Nations Relief and Works Agency (UNRWA) in the Gaza Strip was attacked today by Israeli artillery, sparking a fire which continues to burn. The compound was reportedly housing 700 civilian refugees and storehouses of increasingly scarce food aid at the time of the attack.
But perhaps even more pressing is the nature of the attack, which UNRWA spokesman Chris Gunness said was hit with shells containing the incendiary agent white phosphorus. "What more stark symbolism do you need?" asked the spokesman. "You can't put out white phosphorus with traditional methods such as fire extinguishers. You need sand. We don't have sand."
Though Gunness says Israeli Defense Minister Ehud Barak termed the attack "a grave mistake," Prime Minister Ehud Olmert defended the attack, saying it made him sad but it was legitimate self defense.
With regards to the Collegian, the Israeli representives are among others Craig Hawley & Registered Independent giving us their misguided and unwavering allegience, much like they have done in the past for Bush, Cheney, McCain, and Palin. How ironic that today is the Bush Cabal's last day.
http://www.brasschecktv.com/page/530.html
It's really not a state secret. Unless you depend on the US news media for your information. Israel create Hamas. Now they're using its existence to slaughter Palestinian civilians.
Ron Paul shares the details:
http://www.brasschecktv.com/page/528.html
Israeli military is dropping white phosphorus on Gaza neighborhoods. Who are you going to believe? The Israeli war party PR department or your own eyes?
http://www.brasschecktv.com/page/532.html
Posted January 15, 2009
The headquarters of the United Nations Relief and Works Agency (UNRWA) in the Gaza Strip was attacked today by Israeli artillery, sparking a fire which continues to burn. The compound was reportedly housing 700 civilian refugees and storehouses of increasingly scarce food aid at the time of the attack.
But perhaps even more pressing is the nature of the attack, which UNRWA spokesman Chris Gunness said was hit with shells containing the incendiary agent white phosphorus. "What more stark symbolism do you need?" asked the spokesman. "You can't put out white phosphorus with traditional methods such as fire extinguishers. You need sand. We don't have sand."
Though Gunness says Israeli Defense Minister Ehud Barak termed the attack "a grave mistake," Prime Minister Ehud Olmert defended the attack, saying it made him sad but it was legitimate self defense.
Arvensis
posted 1/20/09 @ 5:48 PM MST
Thank God that American's have not been ultimately cheated through the corrupt election process and we are still able to get representation like Ron Paul. He is a true voice for America and he really does understand what is going on in the world. He is fighting a battle for truth with little support from his peers.
I am disgusted with this situation and with the information I learn everyday. It is sad and utterly scary to see how America has truly been hijacked by these corrupt assholes.
As I pointed out earlier in this thread, our political system is infested with Israeli's who are operating on an agenda that is not for America. Look for your facts in other news outlets that aren't owned by the powers that be. We only get to hear what they want us to hear.
When are the masses going to wake up? What is it going to take to win back America? I observed in complete disgust today as everyone around me was overwhelmed with glee as Uncle Barry was sworn in. Why are we so blind? Take your uncle Barry love glasses off for 10 minutes and do some research! Everybody is so brainwashed they can't sort out what is going on - Why are the citizens of American not up in arms over the FACT that Barry will not release his birth certificate and college transcripts? If he has nothing to hide why go through such an arduous effort to hide the truth? Why have we let OUR constitution be shred to pieces over the last few years? Why do we let the bankster elite of the Federal Reserve Bank bend us over and push us into an instigated economic collapse? Do you know what a central bank is? Do you realize that the money that the Federal Reserve creates is actually unconstitutional and counterfeit?
The sheeple of America are walking willingly into the demise of our nation. Not just willingly but happily and with full support.
Have you really asked yourself why the people that represent you voted in majority to pass out a HUGE bailout to corporate America? These people are supposed to be our servants! Where did we get that money anyway? The FED simply printed it off and lent it to the treasury...hmmm...that just destroys the value of the dollar when you simply put more bills in circulation. Tack on interest to be paid to the FED for lending us that money and... we have perpetual debt that can NEVER be paid off.
Sorry for the rant, but if we ever want to get America back we have some serious foundations to shake. Please, if you think yourself an American and a patriot, you need to read the Constitution of the United States of America. Stop believing every damn thing you hear and peel back a layer or two.
I am disgusted with this situation and with the information I learn everyday. It is sad and utterly scary to see how America has truly been hijacked by these corrupt assholes.
As I pointed out earlier in this thread, our political system is infested with Israeli's who are operating on an agenda that is not for America. Look for your facts in other news outlets that aren't owned by the powers that be. We only get to hear what they want us to hear.
When are the masses going to wake up? What is it going to take to win back America? I observed in complete disgust today as everyone around me was overwhelmed with glee as Uncle Barry was sworn in. Why are we so blind? Take your uncle Barry love glasses off for 10 minutes and do some research! Everybody is so brainwashed they can't sort out what is going on - Why are the citizens of American not up in arms over the FACT that Barry will not release his birth certificate and college transcripts? If he has nothing to hide why go through such an arduous effort to hide the truth? Why have we let OUR constitution be shred to pieces over the last few years? Why do we let the bankster elite of the Federal Reserve Bank bend us over and push us into an instigated economic collapse? Do you know what a central bank is? Do you realize that the money that the Federal Reserve creates is actually unconstitutional and counterfeit?
The sheeple of America are walking willingly into the demise of our nation. Not just willingly but happily and with full support.
Have you really asked yourself why the people that represent you voted in majority to pass out a HUGE bailout to corporate America? These people are supposed to be our servants! Where did we get that money anyway? The FED simply printed it off and lent it to the treasury...hmmm...that just destroys the value of the dollar when you simply put more bills in circulation. Tack on interest to be paid to the FED for lending us that money and... we have perpetual debt that can NEVER be paid off.
Sorry for the rant, but if we ever want to get America back we have some serious foundations to shake. Please, if you think yourself an American and a patriot, you need to read the Constitution of the United States of America. Stop believing every damn thing you hear and peel back a layer or two.
Fahad
posted 1/20/09 @ 6:40 PM MST
Well, obviously registered independent you have absolutely no idea about the history of the conflict in the Middle East. I have debated with a lot of Israelis and most of them by the end of day tell me "well, Arabs have 22 countries, why don't you give us this one?"
One famous muslim scholar once said:
I have debated a hundred scholars and won, however, I have lost when I debated an illiterate.
So excuse me Registered Independent but you are an illiterate in this matter and only watch cnn and fox news. Read about the history of this conflict and you will soon know that the land of palestine belongs to the muslims. To be specific, read about Balfour declaration of 1917.
One famous muslim scholar once said:
I have debated a hundred scholars and won, however, I have lost when I debated an illiterate.
So excuse me Registered Independent but you are an illiterate in this matter and only watch cnn and fox news. Read about the history of this conflict and you will soon know that the land of palestine belongs to the muslims. To be specific, read about Balfour declaration of 1917.
Binyamin
posted 1/20/09 @ 7:07 PM MST
Fahad, Hamas is targeting civilians and Hamas leaders recognized it themselves many times, so you are trying to ignore the facts (or you are just lying). You say that there was no Hamas terrorists inside UN school, but let me ask you where did you get this information from? Were you at the school at the time? Even UN officials confirm that there are Hamas people working at UNRWA, it's no big secret. You can find video online of Hamas firing rockets from right next to the UN school, also you can find a video of armed Palestinian terrorists in Gasa using an ambulance to hide from Israeli soldiers. There is video of Al-Arabia reporter in Gaza Hanan Al-Masri saying that a Grad rocket had been fired from a location near the TV offices at Al-Shuruk tower in Gaza City. Hamas uses this tactics all the time. Concerning the ceasefire - again, Hamas leaders said in December that they are not interested in continuing 6-month truce. So if they say they are not interested in truce it means they want war, and this was their choice, not Israel's. Israeli leaders repeated many times that Israel wants to extend truce. Hamas chose war and Hamas got one.
Yes, there are some Jews who oppose Israeli actions, but there is more who support Israel. And, BTW, many Muslims protest Hamas actions.
I know that many Muslims think that "Palestine belongs to them". It is interesting that many Muslims, and in particular Arabs, leave on the land that did not always belong to them. If you read some history, in particular, history of Arab and Muslim conquests, you will see what I mean. So now these guys say "What we conquered once is ours forever". Sorry guys, it doesn't work in the real world!
Is is also interesting that when Muslims organize massacres, like in Darfur (thousands killed), there is no much of a protest, in particular, from Muslims. When Muslims kill fellow Muslims, like for example Hamas killing hundreds of Fatah people in Gaza, I cannot see crowds protesting around the globe. When Israeli civilians are attacked - no protest again. When Israel attacks Palestinians - it's like the end of the world.. What I see is that these "protesters" are not really concerned about innocent people being killed, they are just looking for some justification of their hate.
Yes, there are some Jews who oppose Israeli actions, but there is more who support Israel. And, BTW, many Muslims protest Hamas actions.
I know that many Muslims think that "Palestine belongs to them". It is interesting that many Muslims, and in particular Arabs, leave on the land that did not always belong to them. If you read some history, in particular, history of Arab and Muslim conquests, you will see what I mean. So now these guys say "What we conquered once is ours forever". Sorry guys, it doesn't work in the real world!
Is is also interesting that when Muslims organize massacres, like in Darfur (thousands killed), there is no much of a protest, in particular, from Muslims. When Muslims kill fellow Muslims, like for example Hamas killing hundreds of Fatah people in Gaza, I cannot see crowds protesting around the globe. When Israeli civilians are attacked - no protest again. When Israel attacks Palestinians - it's like the end of the world.. What I see is that these "protesters" are not really concerned about innocent people being killed, they are just looking for some justification of their hate.
Registered Independent
posted 1/20/09 @ 10:03 PM MST
Response to fahad:
Well you're certainly full of bluster, fahad, but my undergraduate degree is in history, while yours so obviously is not. You're in no sense a scholar, that's for sure.
I'm also neither an "Israeli agent" (how comical!)
nor Jewish.
You claim there are Muslim scholars? Now there's a contradiction in terms if I ever heard one. Since bending over the Koran muttering the same repetitious phrases endlessly is what passes for "education" in the middle east.
And you've obviously done your full share of repetitious muttering, fahad. You're actually still doing just that in your postings here; with a few connecting sentences thrown in between to impersonate rational thought, that is.
All of you holocaust-deniers out there; you've found a kindred soul in fahad, here, the self-proclaimed debater of historical fact.
You should give up the attempt at revisionist history, fahad. None of you Islamofacists are remotely convincing to anyone. Outside of the gullible, uneducated masses of the middle east, that is.
Why don't you drum up another international "Holocaust Denial Conference" again this spring, like you did a couple of years ago? That's always so convincing to the 7th-grade dropouts who spend their weekends from the factory donning white sheets. They're always so helpful in pleading the cause that the Jews and Israel are causing the world's problems.
I'm sure you are considered a highly educated fellow back home, in whatever backwater arab country you hail from. I'm sure you're considered a font of knowledge over there, in fact.
But we have significantly higher standards for both "knowledge" and "facts" here in our country.
And didn't you hear our new President speak today?
Unprovoked violence and threats of violence aren't buying you any credence with anyone in the United States. Plenty of quietly determined enmity, however. Did you happen to notice the set of his jaw? He's listened to quite a few security briefings since the election last November.
Didn't everyone just love Hamas' threats to the Israelis when they moved into Gaza? To the effect that "Gaza will become the Israeli's own graveyard". The threats are always so highly dramatic and ominous, fahad; your people's special gift of speech to the world.
Right before requesting a cease-fire, of course.
We moved on to rational thought quite some time ago.
Well you're certainly full of bluster, fahad, but my undergraduate degree is in history, while yours so obviously is not. You're in no sense a scholar, that's for sure.
I'm also neither an "Israeli agent" (how comical!)
nor Jewish.
You claim there are Muslim scholars? Now there's a contradiction in terms if I ever heard one. Since bending over the Koran muttering the same repetitious phrases endlessly is what passes for "education" in the middle east.
And you've obviously done your full share of repetitious muttering, fahad. You're actually still doing just that in your postings here; with a few connecting sentences thrown in between to impersonate rational thought, that is.
All of you holocaust-deniers out there; you've found a kindred soul in fahad, here, the self-proclaimed debater of historical fact.
You should give up the attempt at revisionist history, fahad. None of you Islamofacists are remotely convincing to anyone. Outside of the gullible, uneducated masses of the middle east, that is.
Why don't you drum up another international "Holocaust Denial Conference" again this spring, like you did a couple of years ago? That's always so convincing to the 7th-grade dropouts who spend their weekends from the factory donning white sheets. They're always so helpful in pleading the cause that the Jews and Israel are causing the world's problems.
I'm sure you are considered a highly educated fellow back home, in whatever backwater arab country you hail from. I'm sure you're considered a font of knowledge over there, in fact.
But we have significantly higher standards for both "knowledge" and "facts" here in our country.
And didn't you hear our new President speak today?
Unprovoked violence and threats of violence aren't buying you any credence with anyone in the United States. Plenty of quietly determined enmity, however. Did you happen to notice the set of his jaw? He's listened to quite a few security briefings since the election last November.
Didn't everyone just love Hamas' threats to the Israelis when they moved into Gaza? To the effect that "Gaza will become the Israeli's own graveyard". The threats are always so highly dramatic and ominous, fahad; your people's special gift of speech to the world.
Right before requesting a cease-fire, of course.
We moved on to rational thought quite some time ago.
Fahad
posted 1/21/09 @ 9:35 AM MST
Binyamin,
You didn't understand my point from the beginning. The main point that I want to stress on is that Israel is a country that have been established on a conquered land. Therefore, Hamas and the other Palestinian liberation organizations are resisting colonization. Therefore, they have every right to fight Israelis. No one was against Israel fighting with armed Palestinians, however, everyone opposes killing innocent people. Look at the facts, how many Israeli civilians have been killed as oppose to Palestinian civilians?
Just so that you don't tell me that I used biased sources, here is an article from the Human Rights Watch website:
http://www.hrw.org/en/news/2009/01/07/gaza-israeli-attack-school-needs-full-un-investigation
About the cease fire, do you what happened in Gaza before this 6 month cease fire has stopped? first of all, CNN confirmed that Israel is the one who broke the cease fire. Second, Israel have made Gaza into what is nowadays called the largest prison in history. It prevented civilians from getting food, electricity, or medical supplies. Therefore, Palestinian civilians were killed slowly because of the lack of each of these supplies. Therefore, Hamas wanted to pressure Israel to stop this siege and to allow basic needs to enter Gaza. However, Israel didn't listen and Hamas didn't fire a single rocket before Israel started doing so.
You didn't understand my point from the beginning. The main point that I want to stress on is that Israel is a country that have been established on a conquered land. Therefore, Hamas and the other Palestinian liberation organizations are resisting colonization. Therefore, they have every right to fight Israelis. No one was against Israel fighting with armed Palestinians, however, everyone opposes killing innocent people. Look at the facts, how many Israeli civilians have been killed as oppose to Palestinian civilians?
Just so that you don't tell me that I used biased sources, here is an article from the Human Rights Watch website:
http://www.hrw.org/en/news/2009/01/07/gaza-israeli-attack-school-needs-full-un-investigation
About the cease fire, do you what happened in Gaza before this 6 month cease fire has stopped? first of all, CNN confirmed that Israel is the one who broke the cease fire. Second, Israel have made Gaza into what is nowadays called the largest prison in history. It prevented civilians from getting food, electricity, or medical supplies. Therefore, Palestinian civilians were killed slowly because of the lack of each of these supplies. Therefore, Hamas wanted to pressure Israel to stop this siege and to allow basic needs to enter Gaza. However, Israel didn't listen and Hamas didn't fire a single rocket before Israel started doing so.
Fahad
posted 1/21/09 @ 9:44 AM MST
Registered Independent,
What a classic way of changing the subject. You have shifted the debate from talking about Israel to talking about Arabs and the holocaust deniers. First of all, the holocaust denial conference was in Iran, which is not an Arab land. 90% of muslims are Sunnis and only about 8% of them are shi'ites. Iran is a country that is ruled by Shi'ites. You call yourself a history graduate and have no idea about this issue? I don't deny the holocaust, and I think that it was a crime. Please don't change the subject and read about Balfour Declaration of 1917.
About Hamas' threats to Israel, do you expect them to give up and say that they are sorry? Look at what they have done, Israel didn't dare to enter the heart of Gaza and couldn't even free their prisoner.
What a classic way of changing the subject. You have shifted the debate from talking about Israel to talking about Arabs and the holocaust deniers. First of all, the holocaust denial conference was in Iran, which is not an Arab land. 90% of muslims are Sunnis and only about 8% of them are shi'ites. Iran is a country that is ruled by Shi'ites. You call yourself a history graduate and have no idea about this issue? I don't deny the holocaust, and I think that it was a crime. Please don't change the subject and read about Balfour Declaration of 1917.
About Hamas' threats to Israel, do you expect them to give up and say that they are sorry? Look at what they have done, Israel didn't dare to enter the heart of Gaza and couldn't even free their prisoner.
Registered Independent
posted 1/21/09 @ 4:12 PM MST
Fahad,
No I don't "call myself" someone with a degree in History. It's just one of the myriad of actual facts in this world that you'd rather not acknowledge.
You started these postings by pleading for mercy for the poor innocent Palestinians, who were being crushed under the heel of the big bad Israelis. Pleading the cause of the same Palestinians who just happened to have voted the terrorist organization, Hamas, into positions of power recently in Gaza.
Now that Israel has finally agreed to the cease-fire and pulled out of Gaza, you suddenly change your tune. Now it's not "poor, poor Palestinians" anymore. Now you are endorsing Hamas' antagonistic but empty drama-queen threats against the Israelis, as well as implying that the Israeli's were in fact not winning hands down!
Whereas the facts are that Hamas and the Palestinians started the violence, but ended up getting roundly stomped. So that they had to "cry uncle" to the international community to prevail upon the Israelis to withdraw.
And as for these fine distinctions you are attempting to draw between Israel-hating, Jew-hating Shiite Muslims and Israel-hating, Jew-hating Sunni Muslims; that is what is commonly known as "a distinction without a difference."
And I'm sure you have no interest in the theological differences between Methodists, Lutherans and Episcopalians. Well we have no interest in the little inter-tribal differences among middle-eastern Muslims, either. We just observe that they are all a batch of hyper-violent morons for killing each other over such trivialities. Although, admittedly, you only kill each other and blow up each other's Mosques when there isn't a Jew or a Hindu close enough at hand when the mood strikes. As it so frequently does.
You have now twice mentioned the Balfour Declaration without making any point whatsoever about it. Unfortunately in your zeal, you simply forgot to state whatever your point was.
No I don't "call myself" someone with a degree in History. It's just one of the myriad of actual facts in this world that you'd rather not acknowledge.
You started these postings by pleading for mercy for the poor innocent Palestinians, who were being crushed under the heel of the big bad Israelis. Pleading the cause of the same Palestinians who just happened to have voted the terrorist organization, Hamas, into positions of power recently in Gaza.
Now that Israel has finally agreed to the cease-fire and pulled out of Gaza, you suddenly change your tune. Now it's not "poor, poor Palestinians" anymore. Now you are endorsing Hamas' antagonistic but empty drama-queen threats against the Israelis, as well as implying that the Israeli's were in fact not winning hands down!
Whereas the facts are that Hamas and the Palestinians started the violence, but ended up getting roundly stomped. So that they had to "cry uncle" to the international community to prevail upon the Israelis to withdraw.
And as for these fine distinctions you are attempting to draw between Israel-hating, Jew-hating Shiite Muslims and Israel-hating, Jew-hating Sunni Muslims; that is what is commonly known as "a distinction without a difference."
And I'm sure you have no interest in the theological differences between Methodists, Lutherans and Episcopalians. Well we have no interest in the little inter-tribal differences among middle-eastern Muslims, either. We just observe that they are all a batch of hyper-violent morons for killing each other over such trivialities. Although, admittedly, you only kill each other and blow up each other's Mosques when there isn't a Jew or a Hindu close enough at hand when the mood strikes. As it so frequently does.
You have now twice mentioned the Balfour Declaration without making any point whatsoever about it. Unfortunately in your zeal, you simply forgot to state whatever your point was.
Originally posted byFahad
Registered Independent,
What a classic way of changing the subject. You have shifted the debate from talking about Israel to talking about Arabs and the holocaust deniers. First of all, the holocaust denial conference was in Iran, which is not an Arab land. 90% of muslims are Sunnis and only about 8% of them are shi'ites. Iran is a country that is ruled by Shi'ites. You call yourself a history graduate and have no idea about this issue? I don't deny the holocaust, and I think that it was a crime. Please don't change the subject and read about Balfour Declaration of 1917.
About Hamas' threats to Israel, do you expect them to give up and say that they are sorry? Look at what they have done, Israel didn't dare to enter the heart of Gaza and couldn't even free their prisoner.
PS
posted 1/21/09 @ 9:54 AM MST
The Truth About the 2009 Gaza Massacre
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qWXx2VYoqbU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qWXx2VYoqbU
Confused
posted 1/21/09 @ 10:03 AM MST
Let's start at the beginning as this is degrading fast:
1) Palestine is an English government invention, not an Ottoman empire.
2) Prior to the English "colonizing" the area called "Palestine", the population was very mixed, by religion, and had very different governmental boundaries.
3) Not all Jews are Europeans, many are ethnically native to "Palestine".
4) Not all Muslims in "Palestine" are terrorists, in fact about 99.99% are NOT.
5) Religion does NOT define ethnicity, or point of genetic origin, for Jews or for Muslims, not since about 2000 years ago, for Jews, and about 1400 years ago for Muslims, anyway...
6) If you want to blame someone for the trouble in "Palestine", look further into the past at invading armies from England and Turkey, and even further back to those from ancient Iraq. Then, and only then, will you see the root of the problem.
7) It is high time that all Jews and Muslims started living together as brothers and sisters, not arch-enemies. Both religions stem from the same fundamental belief systems, and are much more similar to each other than any other two religions on the planet. If either side actually spent time learning the others' religious texts, they would be AMAZED at the actual similarities! If the Prophet Muhammad was never educated in Judaism, (which history says he wasn't), then the only way he could have known what he did, is if he truly was a Prophet...['Course there is some debate about where his family originally came from, though he was not raised by his parents, including some debate that his family may have been originally Jewish from Jerusalem, and were kicked out by the corrupt Rabbinical leadership...are we seeing a pattern here, Israel? You can create your own worst enemies...my mistreating your brothers and sisters...]
8) If you have read the Qura'an, then you know that although Prophet Muhammad distinctly disliked the corruption, which existed in 6th century CE Jerusalem among the then Rabbinical leadership of Judaism, (And there is no question that it did exist, and there are many very devout groups in Judaism who do not recognize the Rabbinical leadership now or then!), he NEVER out-right condemned the Jews. Any Muslim who believes that he did, is not a real Muslim, and any Jew who believes he did, is very misinformed. What he did say, however, is that the Jews need to be observant of their own laws, and that at that time, they were not, and that is a valid statement for anyone of any religion, and applies just as well to Muslims or Christians. [If you are going to claim to be of a certain religion, then please obey the laws of that religion, otherwise you appear to others as a total hypocrite, and liar....and then, is it any wonder that others will begin to condemn you?]
So...now let's start the discussion fresh....
1) Palestine is an English government invention, not an Ottoman empire.
2) Prior to the English "colonizing" the area called "Palestine", the population was very mixed, by religion, and had very different governmental boundaries.
3) Not all Jews are Europeans, many are ethnically native to "Palestine".
4) Not all Muslims in "Palestine" are terrorists, in fact about 99.99% are NOT.
5) Religion does NOT define ethnicity, or point of genetic origin, for Jews or for Muslims, not since about 2000 years ago, for Jews, and about 1400 years ago for Muslims, anyway...
6) If you want to blame someone for the trouble in "Palestine", look further into the past at invading armies from England and Turkey, and even further back to those from ancient Iraq. Then, and only then, will you see the root of the problem.
7) It is high time that all Jews and Muslims started living together as brothers and sisters, not arch-enemies. Both religions stem from the same fundamental belief systems, and are much more similar to each other than any other two religions on the planet. If either side actually spent time learning the others' religious texts, they would be AMAZED at the actual similarities! If the Prophet Muhammad was never educated in Judaism, (which history says he wasn't), then the only way he could have known what he did, is if he truly was a Prophet...['Course there is some debate about where his family originally came from, though he was not raised by his parents, including some debate that his family may have been originally Jewish from Jerusalem, and were kicked out by the corrupt Rabbinical leadership...are we seeing a pattern here, Israel? You can create your own worst enemies...my mistreating your brothers and sisters...]
8) If you have read the Qura'an, then you know that although Prophet Muhammad distinctly disliked the corruption, which existed in 6th century CE Jerusalem among the then Rabbinical leadership of Judaism, (And there is no question that it did exist, and there are many very devout groups in Judaism who do not recognize the Rabbinical leadership now or then!), he NEVER out-right condemned the Jews. Any Muslim who believes that he did, is not a real Muslim, and any Jew who believes he did, is very misinformed. What he did say, however, is that the Jews need to be observant of their own laws, and that at that time, they were not, and that is a valid statement for anyone of any religion, and applies just as well to Muslims or Christians. [If you are going to claim to be of a certain religion, then please obey the laws of that religion, otherwise you appear to others as a total hypocrite, and liar....and then, is it any wonder that others will begin to condemn you?]
So...now let's start the discussion fresh....
Confused
posted 1/21/09 @ 10:26 AM MST
Also, let us remember some historical facts:
1) Who defended the Jews of Spain and Portugal from the Catholic Church in the first millennium CE? (That's right, the "Moors", the invading Muslim armies, who protected their "brothers".)
2) Who physically joined the Muslim armies of Spain? (That's right the Jews, to help defeat Catholic oppression, which unfortunately was a short lived defeat...See the anti Jewish and anti Muslim purges of Spain and Portugal in 1492...does the year ring a bell, Americans?)
3) Where can one find a very mixed culture of Judaism, and Islam, living side by side as brothers? (That's right, Southern Spain, in Al Andalus, even still today.)
Why the problems between Israel and "Palestine" then?
Answer:
1) Arrogance
2) Ignorance
3) Selfishness
And all this among family...what a shameful thing.
Cure these three, and the problem will cease.
1) Who defended the Jews of Spain and Portugal from the Catholic Church in the first millennium CE? (That's right, the "Moors", the invading Muslim armies, who protected their "brothers".)
2) Who physically joined the Muslim armies of Spain? (That's right the Jews, to help defeat Catholic oppression, which unfortunately was a short lived defeat...See the anti Jewish and anti Muslim purges of Spain and Portugal in 1492...does the year ring a bell, Americans?)
3) Where can one find a very mixed culture of Judaism, and Islam, living side by side as brothers? (That's right, Southern Spain, in Al Andalus, even still today.)
Why the problems between Israel and "Palestine" then?
Answer:
1) Arrogance
2) Ignorance
3) Selfishness
And all this among family...what a shameful thing.
Cure these three, and the problem will cease.
Registered Independent
posted 1/21/09 @ 4:55 PM MST
Does the name "El Cid" ring any sort of a bell at all in your imaginary version of the history of Spain? Ask a Spaniard, folks. Not a Muslim.
And we notice lately how Muslims are "helping" the Spanish decide to pull out of Iraq, by blowing up thousands of their civilian train commuters, at one clip.
Aren't they helpful, though.
And we notice lately how Muslims are "helping" the Spanish decide to pull out of Iraq, by blowing up thousands of their civilian train commuters, at one clip.
Aren't they helpful, though.
Originally posted byConfused
Also, let us remember some historical facts:
1) Who defended the Jews of Spain and Portugal from the Catholic Church in the first millennium CE? (That's right, the "Moors", the invading Muslim armies, who protected their "brothers".)
2) Who physically joined the Muslim armies of Spain? (That's right the Jews, to help defeat Catholic oppression, which unfortunately was a short lived defeat...See the anti Jewish and anti Muslim purges of Spain and Portugal in 1492...does the year ring a bell, Americans?)
3) Where can one find a very mixed culture of Judaism, and Islam, living side by side as brothers? (That's right, Southern Spain, in Al Andalus, even still today.)
Why the problems between Israel and "Palestine" then?
Answer:
1) Arrogance
2) Ignorance
3) Selfishness
And all this among family...what a shameful thing.
Cure these three, and the problem will cease.
Fahad
posted 1/21/09 @ 11:02 AM MST
About your comments registered independent regarding Arabs being backwater. I have no idea what kind of history did you study, but every historian should know that Arabs are the ones who invented modern science, all the basis for Math, Chemistry, Medicine, Astronomy, and many others when the Europeans were living in the dark age. Research the history of Muslim science before judging. You are such an ignorant who is filled with hate to Muslims and Arabs.
Registered Independent
posted 1/21/09 @ 4:18 PM MST
Yes of course Fahad. That's why you are attending college in this country. You simply decided to pass up all those stellar citadels of knowledge in the middle east.
Originally posted byFahad
About your comments registered independent regarding Arabs being backwater. I have no idea what kind of history did you study, but every historian should know that Arabs are the ones who invented modern science, all the basis for Math, Chemistry, Medicine, Astronomy, and many others when the Europeans were living in the dark age. Research the history of Muslim science before judging. You are such an ignorant who is filled with hate to Muslims and Arabs.
Binyamin
posted 1/21/09 @ 5:14 PM MST
Fahad, read again what I wrote above. Many Arab and Muslim countries are established on conquered land. In fact, most modern countries are established on conquered land. History is not fair! But you cannot change it. Your point is - when Muslim countries are created on conquered land - it's OK. When someone else does that - it's bad. Fahad, are you a racist who recognizes rights of some nations and does not recognize the same rights of the other nations?
When Hamas tortures and kills hundreds of their fellow Palestinians just because they support Fatah, I can't see angry crowds of Muslims protesting it around the globe. When thousands of Palestinians were killed in Jordan during Black September - no protests! BTW, when Egipt occupied Gaza and Jordan controlled West Bank (1948-1967) there was no talk about the "occupation", "colonization" and "liberation". Egypt and Jordan had plenty of time to establish Palestinian state at exactly same land, but they didn't do it. Any ideas why?
There are millions of people living in Israel (among them more then million Israeli Arabs) and millions of people who leave in Palestinian territories. Most of them want to leave in peace. There are only two ways - the way of peace and the way of war. Most people in Israel and in Palestine want to live in peace. The peaceful solution can be found, but both sides should cooperate to find one. Palestinian authority and Israel are two sides who are looking for the peaceful solution. Israeli leaders said many times that they are ready to recognize Palestinian state. Israel removed all its citizens from Gaza in 2005 and was preparing to withdraw from the West bank. But Hamas is not interested in peace. They don't care about people, including their own people. All they care about is their religiously motivated terror ideology. It is also a racist ideology, calling Jews "sons of apes and pigs". Let me ask you this - do you support them, their racist ideology and their program of ethnic cleansing?
When Hamas tortures and kills hundreds of their fellow Palestinians just because they support Fatah, I can't see angry crowds of Muslims protesting it around the globe. When thousands of Palestinians were killed in Jordan during Black September - no protests! BTW, when Egipt occupied Gaza and Jordan controlled West Bank (1948-1967) there was no talk about the "occupation", "colonization" and "liberation". Egypt and Jordan had plenty of time to establish Palestinian state at exactly same land, but they didn't do it. Any ideas why?
There are millions of people living in Israel (among them more then million Israeli Arabs) and millions of people who leave in Palestinian territories. Most of them want to leave in peace. There are only two ways - the way of peace and the way of war. Most people in Israel and in Palestine want to live in peace. The peaceful solution can be found, but both sides should cooperate to find one. Palestinian authority and Israel are two sides who are looking for the peaceful solution. Israeli leaders said many times that they are ready to recognize Palestinian state. Israel removed all its citizens from Gaza in 2005 and was preparing to withdraw from the West bank. But Hamas is not interested in peace. They don't care about people, including their own people. All they care about is their religiously motivated terror ideology. It is also a racist ideology, calling Jews "sons of apes and pigs". Let me ask you this - do you support them, their racist ideology and their program of ethnic cleansing?
UNRWA
posted 1/21/09 @ 6:24 PM MST
Look at the official website of UN and what it haas to say about Israel's allegations about the ties between the UNRWA and Hamas.
http://www.un.org/unrwa/allegations/index.html
http://www.un.org/unrwa/allegations/index.html
Arvensis
posted 1/22/09 @ 10:34 AM MST
I'm sure the official UN website has no bias on the subject. They are probably more concerned with getting the truth out there than portraying an image they want the world to see.
Give me a break - the UN is just a nice cover-up for powerful people to execute whatever they want, while willingly accepting funds from around the world. Do not be deceived people.
Give me a break - the UN is just a nice cover-up for powerful people to execute whatever they want, while willingly accepting funds from around the world. Do not be deceived people.
Originally posted byUNRWA
Look at the official website of UN and what it haas to say about Israel's allegations about the ties between the UNRWA and Hamas.
http://www.un.org/unrwa/allegations/index.html
UNRWA
posted 1/22/09 @ 10:03 AM MST
In 2004, former UNRWA Commissioner-General Peter Hansen told the Canadian Broadcasting Company, "I am sure that there are Hamas members on the UNRWA payroll and I don't see that as a crime."
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2004/10/04/unwra041004.html
Hamas use UN ambulance to smuggle terrorists in Gaza
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MAR_Iwq9-R0
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2004/10/04/unwra041004.html
Hamas use UN ambulance to smuggle terrorists in Gaza
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MAR_Iwq9-R0
Michael
posted 1/22/09 @ 12:14 PM MST
Throughout so many posts it was written, that Israel deprives Palestinians of food, fuel, electricity and medicines etc. Well, Israel is the only country to ever provide those commodities to Gaza. How about Egypt stepping up for their Muslim brethren and provide all those through Rafiah border? Why doesn't Egypt do anything about humanitarian situation over there in Gaza? Everyone just imply that it is Israel's obligation to support logistics of the very same entity that shells Israeli cities for about 8 years. Israel has pulled its Army form the Gaza strip and removed all the settlements there (over 4000 people who now feel betrayed by their government). Israel provided all the necessary supplies to Gaza and cooperated with Fatah, while Egypt closed down the border crossing in Rafiah right after Israeli solders left it. All that in spite of cities around Gaza being shelled daily by qasam rockets. That was not enough. Palestinians had elected Hamas, which shot every possible Fatah policemen, overthrowing Fatah government (by President Mahmud Abas, aka Abu Mazen, which stays in the West Bank, and has no control of Gaza as though it was different entity). Then Hamas decided to increase the ammount of qasam atackes, built even greater tunnel network in Gaza, increased the range of their rockets, built up a huge ammount of weapons, ammunition, explosves and conducted even more hostile actions on the border.
During my service in the IDF, I saw charges being placed near the border by Palestinians in hope to explode Israeli patrols.
Dozens of trucks went through Karni border crossing daily conducting trade with palestinians, providing them with necessary supplies, and generated revenues to Palestinians by buying their goods. Multiple attacks were conducted on Karni by Hamas. For what reason? Why attack the very same installation which enables Palestinians to get supplies from Israel?
We were seeking for a tunnel all around the boder. But just a day before it was discovered, Hamas terrorists went through it and killed Israeli solders, and kidnapped Gil'ad Shalit.
The worst thing that even if we entered Gaza City (not the same thing as Gaza strip) during the current war and cleaned it from the presence of Hamas, this organization would have been rebuilt with the help of Iran, which is interested in terrorizing Israel. Which brings us to another intersting point - there is no such thing as "guerilla freedom fighter", there are interests of foreing entities. Soviet Union helped the opposing side of US in Vietnam war. US helped Afghanistan to fight Soviet Union. Israel supported Southern Lebanon Army (Christian partisans in Southern Lebanon) against Hezballah (Iran and Syria influenced Muslim guerilla). Iran, a powerfull middle-eastern country, supports Hezballah and Hamas against Israel.
There are no freedom fighters guerilla, there are foreing entities operating marionettes in order to destabilize their opponents, paying money and training guerillas, without the need to conduct general war, loose many troops and recieve damage in their homeland.
I wonder, where is the root of the problems in the middle east?
Is it not somewhere in Iran?
During my service in the IDF, I saw charges being placed near the border by Palestinians in hope to explode Israeli patrols.
Dozens of trucks went through Karni border crossing daily conducting trade with palestinians, providing them with necessary supplies, and generated revenues to Palestinians by buying their goods. Multiple attacks were conducted on Karni by Hamas. For what reason? Why attack the very same installation which enables Palestinians to get supplies from Israel?
We were seeking for a tunnel all around the boder. But just a day before it was discovered, Hamas terrorists went through it and killed Israeli solders, and kidnapped Gil'ad Shalit.
The worst thing that even if we entered Gaza City (not the same thing as Gaza strip) during the current war and cleaned it from the presence of Hamas, this organization would have been rebuilt with the help of Iran, which is interested in terrorizing Israel. Which brings us to another intersting point - there is no such thing as "guerilla freedom fighter", there are interests of foreing entities. Soviet Union helped the opposing side of US in Vietnam war. US helped Afghanistan to fight Soviet Union. Israel supported Southern Lebanon Army (Christian partisans in Southern Lebanon) against Hezballah (Iran and Syria influenced Muslim guerilla). Iran, a powerfull middle-eastern country, supports Hezballah and Hamas against Israel.
There are no freedom fighters guerilla, there are foreing entities operating marionettes in order to destabilize their opponents, paying money and training guerillas, without the need to conduct general war, loose many troops and recieve damage in their homeland.
I wonder, where is the root of the problems in the middle east?
Is it not somewhere in Iran?
JS
posted 1/22/09 @ 1:18 PM MST
Amazing what they get away with isn't it.....
Question: Which country alone in the Middle East has nuclear weapons? Answer:Israel.
Q: Which country in the Middle East refuses to sign the nuclear non-proliferation treaty and bars international inspections? Answer:Israel.
Q: Which country in the Middle East seized the sovereign territory of other nations by military force and continues to occupy it in defiance of United Nations Security Council resolutions? Answer:Israel.
Q: Which country in the Middle East routinely violates the international borders of another sovereign state with warplanes and artillery and naval gunfire? Answer:Israel.
Q: What American ally in the Middle East has for years sent assassins into other countries to kill its political enemies (a practice sometimes called exporting terrorism)? Answer:Israel.
Q: In which country in the Middle East have high-ranking military officers admitted publicly that unarmed prisoners of war were executed? Answer: Israel. Q: What country in the Middle East refuses to prosecute its soldiers who have acknowledged executing prisoners of war? Answer: Israel. Q: What country in the Middle East created 762,000 refugees and refuses to allow them to return to their homes, farms and businesses? Answer: Israel. Q: What country in the Middle East refuses to pay compensation to people whose land, bank accounts and businesses it confiscated? Answer: Israel. Q: In what country in the Middle East was a high-ranking United Nations diplomat assassinated? Answer: Israel. Q: In what country in the Middle East did the man who ordered the assassination of a high-ranking U.N. diplomat become prime minister? Answer: Israel. Q: What country in the Middle East blew up an American diplomatic facility in Egypt and attacked a U.S. ship, the USS Liberty, in international waters, killing 34 and wounding 171 American sailors? Answer: Israel. Q: What country in the Middle East employed a spy, Jonathan Pollard, to steal classified documents and then gave some of them to the Soviet Union? Answer: Israel. Q: What country at first denied any official connection to Pollard, then voted to make him a citizen and has continuously demanded that the American president grant Pollard a full pardon? Answer: Israel. Q. What Middle East country allows American Jewish murderers to flee to its country to escape punishment in the United States and refuses to extradite them once in their custody? Answer: Israel Q. What Middle East country preaches against hate yet builds a shrine and a memorial for a murderer who killed 29 Palestinians while they prayed in their Mosque. Answer: Israel Q: What country on Planet Earth has the second most powerful lobby in the United States, according to a recent Fortune magazine survey of Washington insiders? Answer: Israel. Q. Which country in the Middle East deliberately targeted a U.N. Refugee Camp in Qana, Lebanon and killed 103 innocent men, women, and especially children? Answer: Israel Q: Which country in the Middle East is in defiance of 69 United Nations Security Council resolutions and has been protected from 29 more by U.S. vetoes? Answer: Israel. Q. Which country in the Middle East receives more than one-third of all U.S. aid yet is the 16th richest country in the world? Answer: Israel Q. Which country in the Middle East receives U.S. weapons for free and then sells the technology to the Republic of China even at the objections of the U.S.? Answer: Israel Q. Which country in the Middle East routinely insults the American people by having its Prime Minister address the United States Congress and lecturing them like children on why they have no right to reduce foreign aid? Answer: Israel Q. Which country in the Middle East had its Prime Minister announce to his staff not to worry about what the United States says because "We control America?" Answer: Israel Q. What country in the Middle East was cited by Amnesty International for demolishing more than 4000 innocent Palestinian homes as a means of ethnic cleansing. Answer: Israel Q. Which country in the Middle East has just recently used a weapon of mass destruction, a one-ton smart bomb, dropping it in the center of a highly populated area killing 15 civilians including 9 children? Answer: Israel Q. Which country in the Middle East routinely kills young Palestinian children for no reason other than throwing stones at armored vehicles, bulldozers, or tanks? Answer: Israel Q. Which country in the Middle East signed the Oslo Accords promising to halt any new Jewish Settlement construction, but instead, has built more than 270 new settlements since the signing? Answer: Israel Q. Which country in the Middle East has assassinated more than 100 political officials of its opponent in the last 2 years while killing hundreds of civilians in the process, including dozens of children? Answer: Israel Q.. Which country in the Middle East regularly violates the Geneva Convention by imposing collective punishment on entire towns, villages, and camps, for the acts of a few, and even goes as far as demolishing entire villages while people are still in their homes? Answer: Israel
Question: Which country alone in the Middle East has nuclear weapons? Answer:Israel.
Q: Which country in the Middle East refuses to sign the nuclear non-proliferation treaty and bars international inspections? Answer:Israel.
Q: Which country in the Middle East seized the sovereign territory of other nations by military force and continues to occupy it in defiance of United Nations Security Council resolutions? Answer:Israel.
Q: Which country in the Middle East routinely violates the international borders of another sovereign state with warplanes and artillery and naval gunfire? Answer:Israel.
Q: What American ally in the Middle East has for years sent assassins into other countries to kill its political enemies (a practice sometimes called exporting terrorism)? Answer:Israel.
Q: In which country in the Middle East have high-ranking military officers admitted publicly that unarmed prisoners of war were executed? Answer: Israel. Q: What country in the Middle East refuses to prosecute its soldiers who have acknowledged executing prisoners of war? Answer: Israel. Q: What country in the Middle East created 762,000 refugees and refuses to allow them to return to their homes, farms and businesses? Answer: Israel. Q: What country in the Middle East refuses to pay compensation to people whose land, bank accounts and businesses it confiscated? Answer: Israel. Q: In what country in the Middle East was a high-ranking United Nations diplomat assassinated? Answer: Israel. Q: In what country in the Middle East did the man who ordered the assassination of a high-ranking U.N. diplomat become prime minister? Answer: Israel. Q: What country in the Middle East blew up an American diplomatic facility in Egypt and attacked a U.S. ship, the USS Liberty, in international waters, killing 34 and wounding 171 American sailors? Answer: Israel. Q: What country in the Middle East employed a spy, Jonathan Pollard, to steal classified documents and then gave some of them to the Soviet Union? Answer: Israel. Q: What country at first denied any official connection to Pollard, then voted to make him a citizen and has continuously demanded that the American president grant Pollard a full pardon? Answer: Israel. Q. What Middle East country allows American Jewish murderers to flee to its country to escape punishment in the United States and refuses to extradite them once in their custody? Answer: Israel Q. What Middle East country preaches against hate yet builds a shrine and a memorial for a murderer who killed 29 Palestinians while they prayed in their Mosque. Answer: Israel Q: What country on Planet Earth has the second most powerful lobby in the United States, according to a recent Fortune magazine survey of Washington insiders? Answer: Israel. Q. Which country in the Middle East deliberately targeted a U.N. Refugee Camp in Qana, Lebanon and killed 103 innocent men, women, and especially children? Answer: Israel Q: Which country in the Middle East is in defiance of 69 United Nations Security Council resolutions and has been protected from 29 more by U.S. vetoes? Answer: Israel. Q. Which country in the Middle East receives more than one-third of all U.S. aid yet is the 16th richest country in the world? Answer: Israel Q. Which country in the Middle East receives U.S. weapons for free and then sells the technology to the Republic of China even at the objections of the U.S.? Answer: Israel Q. Which country in the Middle East routinely insults the American people by having its Prime Minister address the United States Congress and lecturing them like children on why they have no right to reduce foreign aid? Answer: Israel Q. Which country in the Middle East had its Prime Minister announce to his staff not to worry about what the United States says because "We control America?" Answer: Israel Q. What country in the Middle East was cited by Amnesty International for demolishing more than 4000 innocent Palestinian homes as a means of ethnic cleansing. Answer: Israel Q. Which country in the Middle East has just recently used a weapon of mass destruction, a one-ton smart bomb, dropping it in the center of a highly populated area killing 15 civilians including 9 children? Answer: Israel Q. Which country in the Middle East routinely kills young Palestinian children for no reason other than throwing stones at armored vehicles, bulldozers, or tanks? Answer: Israel Q. Which country in the Middle East signed the Oslo Accords promising to halt any new Jewish Settlement construction, but instead, has built more than 270 new settlements since the signing? Answer: Israel Q. Which country in the Middle East has assassinated more than 100 political officials of its opponent in the last 2 years while killing hundreds of civilians in the process, including dozens of children? Answer: Israel Q.. Which country in the Middle East regularly violates the Geneva Convention by imposing collective punishment on entire towns, villages, and camps, for the acts of a few, and even goes as far as demolishing entire villages while people are still in their homes? Answer: Israel
Zionist
posted 1/22/09 @ 8:42 PM MST
It certainly appears that somebody watched too much of Al-Manar TV ;-)
From which Muslim hate-site you have picked allthis garbage: idigalqaida.org or osamabinladenisaman.org? ;-)
From which Muslim hate-site you have picked allthis garbage: idigalqaida.org or osamabinladenisaman.org? ;-)
Registered Independent
posted 1/22/09 @ 3:55 PM MST
Response to JS:
Good grief, you're a walking Palestinian propaganda machine. And you probably actually believe your own completely contrived drivel.
The fact is that Israel is all alone in the middle east. Completely surrounded by hostile Muslim countries who have been trying to kill them and drive them out for the last 60 years. Who have been blowing up Israeli civilians in cafes and on buses this entire time, totaling in the thousands. And for the last 5 years at least have been firing rockets into Israeli civilian areas.
This is the Islamic "good-neighbor" policy.
Good grief, you're a walking Palestinian propaganda machine. And you probably actually believe your own completely contrived drivel.
The fact is that Israel is all alone in the middle east. Completely surrounded by hostile Muslim countries who have been trying to kill them and drive them out for the last 60 years. Who have been blowing up Israeli civilians in cafes and on buses this entire time, totaling in the thousands. And for the last 5 years at least have been firing rockets into Israeli civilian areas.
This is the Islamic "good-neighbor" policy.
Zionist
posted 1/22/09 @ 9:54 PM MST
The whole issue of "stolen land" is a fruit of Arab's imagination and that of their eager but ignorant supporters in the Western World. The Holy Land has been a cradle of the Jewish Civilization for over a thousand years. The whole Jewish tradition and nation is intimately linked to this land and always been throughout the past 3,500 years. During this period the Jews gave the World a notion of Monotheism and Bible which became a cornerstones o ALL the Western (and ironically Muslim) civilization for the next 2000 years. Jewish presence has been continuously maintained there since the destruction of Second Temple in the 1st century AD and until the 20th century, despite all the massacres perpetrated by Arabs, Crusaders and Turks. The Arabs, on the other hand have been a nomads until the 7th century AD without any culture, literacy or even alphabet who worshipped the "black rock" that fallen down from the sky. Having met Jews they adopted Jewish religion, alphabet and their values. But even after conquering the Holy Land from Greeks they failed to build and permanently settling there. Their Koran DOES NOT contain a words JERUSALEM even a single time. And that is just because it never been (nor it is) important in their religion. Then, for over another 800 years this place have been a small and forgotten backward province of the vast Osman Empire. No Arab state existed there all this time. Their ancient linkage of so called "palestinians" to this land is nothing more than a propaganda tool in the information war that the Arabs are trying (with moderate success) to wage against the Jewish State.
Now, having lost ALL it wars against Israel (even when they attacked all at the same time), Arabs always tried to find justifications for their defeat.
The dream of isolating the only Jewish State by the means of economic and military blockade is not new and has been flourishing in the minds of Arabs since the very creation of State of Israel. They tried to intimidate and blackmail the Western powers for their support (who merely tried to stop another Jewish genocide in less than a Century) of Israel. Hey failed on that diplomatic field too. Besides, Israel is one of the world's biggest producer and exporter of hi-tech arms which pretty much guaranties it's military and economic independence in the foreseeable future.
Now, having lost ALL it wars against Israel (even when they attacked all at the same time), Arabs always tried to find justifications for their defeat.
The dream of isolating the only Jewish State by the means of economic and military blockade is not new and has been flourishing in the minds of Arabs since the very creation of State of Israel. They tried to intimidate and blackmail the Western powers for their support (who merely tried to stop another Jewish genocide in less than a Century) of Israel. Hey failed on that diplomatic field too. Besides, Israel is one of the world's biggest producer and exporter of hi-tech arms which pretty much guaranties it's military and economic independence in the foreseeable future.
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John
posted 12/09/08 @ 10:26 AM MST
Less than 24 hours later, the regular armies of Egypt, Trans-Jordan, Syria, Lebanon and Iraq invaded the country. Though they were repulsed, they took over 6,000 Jewish lives.
From 1948 until today, Israel has defended itself successfully in the 1948 War for Independence, the 1956 Sinai Campaign, the 1967 Six Day War, and the 1973 Yom Kippur War. It has been a long standing goal of the Arabs to forever erase the Jewish people from this earth.
For you to presume that a 23% arab unemployment rate in Israel is a human rights violation, when Jews in Arab countries are given absolutely no rights at all, is a heinous testament to your ignorance.