The Rocky Mountain Collegian

There are people all over this board that are for and against McSwane. I agree that publishing an obscenity in a college newspaper lacks professionalism. There is no question about that. However, what I am forcefully against are the many people who are pushing for McSwane's resignation because of their own hidden political agendas. They simply won't admit that what they are really angry about is that "Bush" came after "F*&K". I don't even like McSwane, but I like my first amendment rights. And if you want to make it a political issue then I will defend him. As for defending his character, that is a different story. It probably wasn't the best move on the part of the College Republicans to claim to be the "voice" of CSU and organize a petition for McSwane's resignation. This made it a political issue and not an issue of McSwane's professionalism as an editor. These certain people can easily be countered by asking them one simple question "Should McSwane be reprimanded or forced to resign for making political statements?" It is a yes or no answer. None of them will answer this question because they know that answering "yes" means that without question they are going against our first amendment rights. So I ask all of you "Should McSwane be reprimanded or forced to resign for making political statements?" YES or NO please.

Originally posted by

Michael Yeager

I am realized that there were more people there to support him than to punish him.

When will the Collegian "journalists" read the first amendment? It only guarantees freedom of the press and freedom of speech against government censorship.

Exercising individual freedom of speech is one thing; the individual has to have little to no responsibility for what they say. Freedom of the press is another thing all together; they do have a responsibility to their readership and advertisers. This seems to be lost on the Collegian editorial board.

The reality is, if you offend your readers and/or your advertisers they will pull back funding. That is their right not to listen or support what the media outlet says.

Mr. McSwane, and the other editors that sided with him, all had the right to print flyers, pass them out, stand on street corners and say what they want, or even using their own money print their own paper. Instead, they abused their readers, their advertisers and their positions.

They have much growing up to do.

Ok. Commonsense.

We all know and most of us agree that McSwane offended some readers and advertisers as well as abused his authority as an editor. For that he should and already is facing the consequences. But you still haven't answered my question, "Should McSwane be reprimanded or forced to resign for making political statements?" Yes or no.

Just for review since some seem to think that this situation does not apply to the First Amendment:

Amendment I
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances."

What this means is that McSwane can not "legally" be reprimanded or forced to resign solely on the basis of making political statements according to our First Amendment. If McSwane were to be fired, which I highly doubt it, and his case were to come before the Supreme Court, they would have to prove to our governmental authority that he was fired for professional reasons and not for his political ideals.

yes you are correct in that realization 19 supported the editor in Chief, whereas 12 speakers signed up to call for hi resignation.

Originally posted by

Michael Yeager

I am realized that there were more people there to support him than to punish him.

Originally posted by

Zack Girson

Is a copy of this meeting available? Or will it possibly be posted online? There are several of the speeches that I would like to watch again (I'm sure you know which they are).

I put some clips of it on my youtube. search for jkeentauna.

Originally posted by

Zack Girson

Is a copy of this meeting available? Or will it possibly be posted online? There are several of the speeches that I would like to watch again (I'm sure you know which they are).

I searched for "jkeentauna" on youtube but found nothing so far. Is there some special way to find it that I'm not aware of? o.O

Originally posted by

rawr

'Taser this...Obama is a n*****'

Is Ed Haynes really comparing a racial slur to an incredibly commonly used curse word? Way to make a completely useless analogy.

Right on! All speech is not the same, and some should be protected by the 1st amendment and some of it not! Wait! Ooops! I just read the 1st Amendment and it does not differentiate between what is protected and what is not. I guess the 1st Amendment is blind to the content of that speech. Sorry. I guess racial slurs are also protected.

Si

Originally posted by

Kelly Walters

NOT giving a F*** is profanity. Yes Virginia, there is profanity but you won't find it in the F*** Bush headline.

AMEN and AMEN! There are important points and there are distracting idiocies. Priorities PLEASE!
A "cussword" is not worse than over a million dead and a nation and culture destroyed -- along with destroying our own nation, its people and environment!
Time for something POSITIVE to carry the day!

Originally posted by

jo

All well and good but these kids who think so highly of this will turn out just like the Woodstock generation and continually screw this country up. I loved the editorial and wish that what we thought in our youth hung on until we matured. Comparing this to the n-word is a typical twist on what the truth is. TO bad you kids will just turn into capitalists like your parents who went to Woodstock!

It's so sweet to hear you lament your spent youth. I guess it sucks that your peers all grew up, and you never did. Idealism usually wanes with maturity when real life sets in. Why don't you grow up, look at reality, and stop lamenting the past?

Agreed. This paper should be an interesting source of future comment and expression, at least for the immediate future. I applaud the independent ideas/opinions exhibited by the editor and staff of the Collegian, and I would love to see it "allowed" to continue with these current dissidents in place (Remember, our Founding Fathers were dissidents). Who wants to read anything that has been influenced by a few weak-shelled, offended, conservatives, not to mention the almighty dollar. I'd rather see the Collegian not exist than to see it bow to the whims of a few dollar-contributing whiners who secretly use the "F" word everytime they're cut off in traffic, stub a toe, or "practicing" their rights in a bathroom stall in Minneapolis. Good job, Collegian Staff, for at least sparking some interest from many readers--myself included. Refreshing!

Originally posted by

Anton Bursch

It's telling that there are actually people saying that the editorial shouldn't have been run due to loss of advertising for the paper.

THAT is the very thing that FUCK BUSH is about.

Give us liberty or death. That is the demand of a true patriot.

Liberty OR Death.

Not Safety for Slavery.

I thought that the US learned that forcing native peoples with pain of death and/or displacement to your way of life so we can feel safer and grow wealthier was a mistake the last 2 times we did it.

You know... when we stole this land from the natives because we deemed them barbarians and decided it was our manifest destinity to kill them all or at least stuff them into reserves.

Or the time we stole a people from their own country and made slaves so we could get wealthier and told ourselves it was ok because they were barbarians.

Oh, and of course, all in the name of God. We just don't mention that our God is Money.

Some people don't want to sell their soul and liberty and the lives of others for money.

We should applaud them, not accuse them.

Originally posted by

Anton Bursch

It's telling that there are actually people saying that the editorial shouldn't have been run due to loss of advertising for the paper.

THAT is the very thing that FUCK BUSH is about.

Give us liberty or death. That is the demand of a true patriot.

Liberty OR Death.

Not Safety for Slavery.

I thought that the US learned that forcing native peoples with pain of death and/or displacement to your way of life so we can feel safer and grow wealthier was a mistake the last 2 times we did it.

You know... when we stole this land from the natives because we deemed them barbarians and decided it was our manifest destinity to kill them all or at least stuff them into reserves.

Or the time we stole a people from their own country and made slaves so we could get wealthier and told ourselves it was ok because they were barbarians.

Oh, and of course, all in the name of God. We just don't mention that our God is Money.

Some people don't want to sell their soul and liberty and the lives of others for money.

We should applaud them, not accuse them.

You are so right on! Let's go back further now. What about the Chinese? Remember the Huns that displaced our native German "barbarian" stock when they stole our land in Eastern Europe? And what about the Italians? Those crazy Romans enslaved much of the world. Remember the Angles, Saxons and Jutes that stole from and killed our Celtic ancestors and banished us into little islands north and west of Britania? We should all rise up against our evil oppressors and show them that we are not barbarians. Money? We don't need that. It's evil. Let's just trade wumpum and live in peace!

As a current student at CSU I am extremely proud that we have people on our newspaper staff that have printed a controversial but realistic point of view, obviously supported by many students and staff. That you are embarrassed for the school speaks to your clear misunderstanding of college students and the editorial staff's right to voice the opinions of their student body.

I completely stand by J. David McSwane and the entire editorial staff of The Collegian for their boldness, open-mindedness and their courage to stand up against the conservative agenda that has been holding people back for so long.

Originally posted by

AD Foster

Last night's meeting made it painfully obvious college is the new high school. The slow-pitch softball questions asked of McSwane (with little to no follow-up on his non-answers) to the poorly reasoned opinions on both sides of the debate, clearly demonstrated that argumentation is a skill sorely lacking.

Needless to say, these arguments wouldn't fly in a graduate level environment, and they shouldn't in an undergrad one either.

Very true .... This was an orchestrated WHITEWASH that would make Bush proud!

Originally posted by

Davey T Ice

When I attended CSU (84 - 89), the campus was a hotbed of apathy -- and this was during the Reagan era. It's wonderful to see the student body worked up about a political issue. I can only hope it lasts. McSwane's stunt may not have been the brightest, but it has had a net positive effect.

Amen. Apathy is what go us this P2resident.

Andy,

Can you please explain to me. How is defending your first amendment rights not patriotic and not an act of defending your country? Also, is joining the army the only way that you can show patriotism and love for your country? Also, one more question. "Should McSwain be reprimanded or forced to resign for making political statements?" Yes or no answer on that one please.

Originally posted by

Andy

haha it's funny to see how many people just whine and whine about stuff like this. All I hear is just complaint after complaint and do nothing about it. People just try to be controversial, get media coverage. they try to be bizarre to see if they capture the attention of anyone. all they are doing is screaming loud and actually saying nothing at all. Shut up. McSwane should act like a man, and resign. For all of you whinning, hopefully you vote. and If you're so patriotic, then join the army. being a patriot is about defending your country, whether or not you like the guy in power is out of the equation. If you love your country so much, then join the army.

Bryan,

Can you please provide us with a list of the businesses that wrote in saying that they will "never" hire a CSU graduate. I doubt that you can provide one. Also "Never" is a very strong word. I personally would not want to work for any organization that would "never" hire me solely on the basis of a controversy over the editor of my college newspaper. They would have to have a pretty shallow minded management don't you think?

Originally posted by

Bryan Stanford

If a CEO or manager of a company publicly said something or published something that is bad for business, They would be fired. McSwane is running a business as editor of the paper. He said something bad for business. He should be fired.

That argument is both valid and sound. I think Bush is no more intelligent than most CSU grads we put out there. However, McSwane can certainly articulate that in some other way. After all, we have business people writing in saying they will never hire a graduate of CSU after this. Thank you McSwane and Co., you've singlehandedly shifted the demand curve for my employment down, reducing the price that I can get paid for work with my degrees. Good Work. You are batting 1.000 this year.

Originally posted by

Common Sense

When will the Collegian "journalists" read the first amendment? It only guarantees freedom of the press and freedom of speech against government censorship.

(edited)

They have much growing up to do.

Exactly. These Liberal children are up in arms about something that has nothing to do with the intent of the First Ammendment. I can't say I really blame them, however; they've been told time and time again that if ANYONE censors you in any way, they are violating your First Ammendment rights. How about, you teachers and professors, start teaching children what the First Ammendment REALLY means? That might be a refreshing slap across their smug little faces (figuratively speaking, of course).


The First Ammendment applies to government censorship. Not private business. Not your mom and dad.

Plain.

Simple.

[QUOTE id="1a69c9c4-2c96-4a2a-b50a-92080ac59664"]When will the Collegian "journalists" read the first amendment? It only guarantees freedom of the press and freedom of speech against government censorship.

Ace,

While you forcecully display your ignorance by labeling defenders of our first amendment rights "liberal children" here is the first amendment taken directly from the constitution:

Amendment I
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances."

What this means is that McSwane can not "legally" be reprimanded or forced to resign solely on the basis of making political statements according to our First Amendment. If McSwane were to be fired, which I highly doubt it, and his case were to come before the Supreme Court, they would have to prove to our governmental authority that he was fired solely for professional reasons and not for his political ideals. So, I have one question for you, "Should McSwane be reprimanded or forced to resign for political reasons?" Yes or no. And if so, how is that not a breach of our first amendment rights?

By the way Ace,

Why don't you go back and ask "your" teachers and professors why they did not teach you how to spell AMENDMENT. :)

Originally posted by

Common Sense

When will the Collegian "journalists" read the first amendment? It only guarantees freedom of the press and freedom of speech against government censorship.

Exercising individual freedom of speech is one thing; the individual has to have little to no responsibility for what they say. Freedom of the press is another thing all together; they do have a responsibility to their readership and advertisers. This seems to be lost on the Collegian editorial board.

The reality is, if you offend your readers and/or your advertisers they will pull back funding. That is their right not to listen or support what the media outlet says.

Mr. McSwane, and the other editors that sided with him, all had the right to print flyer's, pass them out, stand on street corners and say what they want, or even using their own money print their own paper. Instead, they abused their readers, their advertisers and their positions.

They have much growing up to do.

Originally posted by

mark b

Mcswane is another evil anti-american. If this POS wanted to get students thinking about issues...he may have tried to do it with some dignity. Its nice to know our troops are giving up their lives so they can defend the freedom of McSwane and the other hate spitting far left nutjobs. The next article should read FUCK MCSWANE! Dont worry though McSwane, i see your far left buddies, the ACLU are to the rescue. I will never read your newspaper nor will my company ever advertise with you again.

If this is the extent of the professionalism of your business, then I am positive that the Collegian doesn't want your support anyways. One would expect a little bit more from a business owner. How sad...

Originally posted by

AndrewLowery

I do believe Mr. McSwane and his Staff owe Mr. Bush an apology as a person.

This has got to be the most absurd post I've read in the past week of this controversy.

If anyone owes an apology it is the Disaster in Chief for his attitude of Fuck the Constitution!!!